OO Lshape to around & around ?

[fourtytwo]

Having changed to OO from N in 2021 my first layout is/was an L shape branch terminus to fiddle/storage yard, end to end like this

However after 3 years of operating experience I don't think it suits me, mostly because the running time from leaving the station to stopping again in the yard or vice-versa is maybe 10 seconds or so, both requiring manual intervention so there is no "watch the trains go by" time at all.
Given these are steam outline trains the potential for automating the fiddle/storage yard to return trains is not really practicable.

So within the very limited space available (corner of a room) I have decided to investigate a round layout with a return loop and terminus, the scheme I have drawn come from the redoubtable CJ Freezer in one of his track plans books compressed into 6x8Ft or 1.8x2.4M.

They both suite 4 coach plus loco trains but the latter layout has the advantage of the return loop as well as continuous running and SOME storage (not as much as previously).

To squeeze this layout in the minimum radius has become a mere 18" (460mm) and all the points are the same radius, gone are large radius points and curves, however all my loco's are tanks (3 coupled axles) and I don't have any super long coaches!

Am I completely mad to rip up what I have, or is a change more likely to re-ignite waning interest ?

Any layout suggestions welcome

[Mountain]

I think that trackplan is great. I too find I need something more than end to end. Need trains to go somewhere!

[Flashbang]

You have designed in what is called a Reverse loop i.e. where the outside rail meets the inside rail and that causes a short circuit on the controller.
Depending on what control method is to be used - DC or DCC you will need to take some specific actions to resolve the shorting issue.
Let us know the control system to be used and we can advise you further.

[fourtytwo]

I think that trackplan is great. I too find I need something more than end to end. Need trains to go somewhere!

Thank you Mountain, after 3 years I finally got it, as I say my 1st and last E2E!
For a mostly lone operator it's essential the trains turn themselves around and the ability to just go around!
It has everything I wanted but I did not think I had enough space, good for CJF and his mountains (pun) of idea's god rest his soul.

The destruction phase has already started so guess I need to start a new thread.

[fourtytwo]

You have designed in what is called a Reverse loop i.e. where the outside rail meets the inside rail and that causes a short circuit on the controller.
Depending on what control method is to be used - DC or DCC you will need to take some specific actions to resolve the shorting issue.
Let us know the control system to be used and we can advise you further.

Thank you Flashbang. I have been building layouts for over half a century and a fair few with lot's of reverse loops so I am comfortable with that

I belong to an older generation of knob twiddlers so definitely not DCC, I have yet to find anything it can do to justify the cost but that's just my opinion

[kebang]

I also was very restricted with space so i built this 72 x42in layout about 4 years ago. lots of 1st rad curves so traffic pretty restricted to small tank locos with 6 wheel coaches.
The layout designed by Forty Two is of course far superior to my effort , which was all I could fit into my space. Like other posters here I do like to watch my trains go around!

[fourtytwo]

That's a fantastic little layout Kebang, same idea half the space I am amazed!!
I won't show it to the boss though, could set back my delicate space negotiations hahaha
I envy you living in such a lovely place, it's cold and raining here.....

[Dad-1]

Fourtytwo, believe me, kebang has had weather beyond our wildest
dreams, or should I say nightmare.
There are a few times I can appreciate our cold & wet weather.

Negotiated some space ? well done, All I have is the loft, well there
is the shed and a few things find their way into the garage.

Geoff T.

[aleopardstail]

I think and out & back reverse loop with through running is pretty much spot on - in limited space you either have a terminus or sharply curved platforms. its also good to have a running in loop and I don't think 18" for tank engines and smaller coaches is a problem at all.

about the only suggestion, the three inner sidings off the passing loop could do with a small headshunt parallel to the running line, even if only as far as the curve, but ideally slightly longer curving as soon as it leaves the extra point this would require - means that yard can be worked without fouling the running loop.

given the limited space its never going to be perfect but thats a damned good concept.

one to watch is needing to uncouple on the platform roads, that reverse track is going to make it a stretch, could, maybe, get that closer to the running line to help with this before it dives off to the side?

[fourtytwo]

Negotiated some space ? well done, All I have is the loft, well there
is the shed and a few things find their way into the garage.
Geoff T.

Thanks for the comment Geoff, I don't have a shed, I do have half the garage but that's my workshop and I don't think sawdust & trains mix very well! We have not yet gotten around to a puka loft hatch plus it's bloody cold up there in winter so here I am in a bit of nice warm living space

[fourtytwo]

I think and out & back reverse loop with through running is pretty much spot on - in limited space you either have a terminus or sharply curved platforms. its also good to have a running in loop and I don't think 18" for tank engines and smaller coaches is a problem at all.

about the only suggestion, the three inner sidings off the passing loop could do with a small headshunt parallel to the running line, even if only as far as the curve, but ideally slightly longer curving as soon as it leaves the extra point this would require - means that yard can be worked without fouling the running loop.

given the limited space its never going to be perfect but thats a damned good concept.

one to watch is needing to uncouple on the platform roads, that reverse track is going to make it a stretch, could, maybe, get that closer to the running line to help with this before it dives off to the side?

Thank you for your comments Leopard, I have often thought about commenting on yours but don't feel qualified. Meanwhile I agree the yard access is a bit wanting in several ways but I thought I might leave it and the running loop till last on the actual laying out to see if I could improve it a bit. On the station access front I will actually be operating the layout from that side so the central wells will only be used for cleaning & derailments etc. A backscene will hide the storage loops with just the single line portion of the loop visible.

[aleopardstail]

I think and out & back reverse loop with through running is pretty much spot on - in limited space you either have a terminus or sharply curved platforms. its also good to have a running in loop and I don't think 18" for tank engines and smaller coaches is a problem at all.

about the only suggestion, the three inner sidings off the passing loop could do with a small headshunt parallel to the running line, even if only as far as the curve, but ideally slightly longer curving as soon as it leaves the extra point this would require - means that yard can be worked without fouling the running loop.

given the limited space its never going to be perfect but thats a damned good concept.

one to watch is needing to uncouple on the platform roads, that reverse track is going to make it a stretch, could, maybe, get that closer to the running line to help with this before it dives off to the side?

Thank you for your comments Leopard, I have often thought about commenting on yours but don't feel qualified. Meanwhile I agree the yard access is a bit wanting in several ways but I thought I might leave it and the running loop till last on the actual laying out to see if I could improve it a bit. On the station access front I will actually be operating the layout from that side so the central wells will only be used for cleaning & derailments etc. A backscene will hide the storage loops with just the single line portion of the loop visible.

beauty of this hobby, everyone is qualified

my heap is operated from the station side as well, I think this is perfect, because I'm doing it..

very good idea to lay it in bits, and operate it before going further too

[kebang]

Reflecting on my last post I realised that the layout I built 4yrs ago was 6in narrower than the plan I posted. This is the corrected plan together with another option. The 2nd. option allows 2nd rad running everywhere apart from the rev loop, so 2nd rad rolling stock can still be used on the layout (Giving point to point plus out & back operation; as well as goods yard access)

2revloop options.png (104.46 KiB) Viewed 1957 times

(Just being hit by another typhoon Geoff! no damage this time!)