DC Sound Options - Help/ideas

[jwpalfrey]

Hi all, I have a large collection of 00 DC locomotives and I'd really like to add sound to my layout (ideally the locos).

I've looked at the TrainTech unit, but it's laggy in operation which is a shame, and I'm a real diesel fan and would prefer more diesel sound tracks from iconic engines, EE37 (tractor) EE50 (hoover) HST Valenta... The list goes on. I could do the same with steam with GWR "bark" and LMS deep chuff etc etc.

I've seen some auto chuffers which seem to be the way I'd like to go, however I was thinking of using bluetooth speakers in loco's/rollingstock in order that the auto-chuffer could send the "sound" to the loco rather than being a stand alone speaker. Have I invented something or has anyone been there and done this already?

I feel that diesel in particular (as the train-tech item does) could be simple, with idling sound, accellerating sound, coasting sound and steady state sounds as diesels typically have a few load cases driving the engine rpm.

I know I'm probabily asking for everything, but the engineer in me can see this should be possible, track feed to assess, load, speed and if accelerating, decellerating or steady state. A search on the net had thrown up some ideas, but I can't be the only one who wants sound but doesn't want to convert to DCC with the cost of 20-30 decoders and sound chips.

[Bigmet]

... was thinking of using bluetooth speakers in loco's/rollingstock in order that the auto-chuffer could send the "sound" to the loco rather than being a stand alone speaker. Have I invented something or has anyone been there and done this already?...

Bachmann USA were offering a bluetooth based control system a year or three ago, capability and current availability not known to me. Some googling should dig it out.

... the engineer in me can see this should be possible, track feed to assess, load, speed and if accelerating, decelerating or steady state. A search on the net had thrown up some ideas...

The independent engineer in me suggests that if you really want a DIY approach then go for it.

There are many ways to explore; one you may not have thought of is if a layout scene presents as a single stereo sound stage, then play selected recordings (via decent sized and appropriately stereo soundstage positioned speakers) timed to synch with the train movements. Because our vision is 'line of sight' and effectively instantaneous, but sound is multipath and much slower, we accept minor lacks of synch between vision and the associated sound, because that is the reality of the environment we live in. The listener will automatically link the sounds to the appropriate moving objects; give this a whirl if you are in doubt!

... I can't be the only one who wants sound but doesn't want to convert to DCC with the cost of 20-30 decoders and sound chips.

The educated in economics engineer in me gently cautions that this indication of price sensitivity will place a hefty constraint on what can be done independently; and in terms of risk mitigation, the cost of a few sound decoders and a DCC system for a trial will be circa 50% recoverable, as against minimal recovery potential of a DIY project that doesn't satisfy.

I actually don't like sound effects on model railway. All metal wheels on full size trains running on stone ballasted track in 4mm makes a very satisfying railway sound. I'd rather not mask that, I like the 9' wb mineral train running over a track joint with a regular beat, concluding with a slightly longer beat as the 16' wb guards van goes past. Chacun a son gout...

[Richard08]

I feel that diesel in particular (as the train-tech item does) could be simple, with idling sound, accellerating sound, coasting sound and steady state sounds as diesels typically have a few load cases driving the engine rpm.

Diesel sound with DCC is a tad disappointing. Maybe others do it differently, but the Zimo and ESU decoders I have just sound 'accelerating' when the engine is moving, accelerating or not, rather than responding to a speed in crease and dropping back when he set speed is reached, then going back to idle when slowing down/coasting. The ESU one does have 'Drive Hold' function which is supposed to allow you to get revved up before it moves off - but it doesn't seem to actually do anything! TBH I rarely use sound now.

[centenary]

I feel that diesel in particular (as the train-tech item does) could be simple, with idling sound, accellerating sound, coasting sound and steady state sounds as diesels typically have a few load cases driving the engine rpm.

Diesel sound with DCC is a tad disappointing. Maybe others do it differently, but the Zimo and ESU decoders I have just sound 'accelerating' when the engine is moving, accelerating or not, rather than responding to a speed in crease and dropping back when he set speed is reached, then going back to idle when slowing down/coasting. The ESU one does have 'Drive Hold' function which is supposed to allow you to get revved up before it moves off - but it doesn't seem to actually do anything! TBH I rarely use sound now.

Sorry, cant agree with this unless you have 'old' sound chips?

I think diesel sound great on DCC although I guess with different sound files available, some sound better than others. I admit the horns sound weedy though!

Ive a couple of new Bachmann, class 37 and 57 that have newer Loksound 5 decoders. None sound accelerating unless doing so. If yours are, Id suggest you've engaged a function (F6?) unwittingly?

Drive hold does alter the engine speed on mine without increasing the loco speed.

Have you tried resetting cv8 and starting again?

[Bufferstop]

To me the full blown sound of a loco, diesel or steam, coming from a 1/76th scale loco just does not compute, even if the loco is moving at true scale speed. Perhaps I've spent too much time in the past trying to put together believable sound effects. It's an inconvenient fact that a highly accurate recording of a real sound rarely comes out of the speakers sounding the way our ears expect it to, so I've not rushed to incorporate sound into my layout. Instead I put my effort into suppressing non authentic noises from locos and enhance wheel and rail sounds where possible.

[Richard08]

It's an inconvenient fact that a highly accurate recording of a real sound rarely comes out of the speakers sounding the way our ears expect it to, so I've not rushed to incorporate sound into my layout.

I wasn't actually referring to the sound quality per se, but yes, I think the lack of bass/lower mid range is perhaps a reason I'm not deeply into sound - coupled with the sound being, at least for the 08 and Western I have, recorded in the cab rather than from the outside which sounds entirely different. I think my expectations were wrong there!

[Richard08]

Ive a couple of new Bachmann, class 37 and 57 that have newer Loksound 5 decoders. None sound accelerating unless doing so. If yours are, Id suggest you've engaged a function (F6?) unwittingly?

Drive hold does alter the engine speed on mine without increasing the loco speed.

Have you tried resetting cv8 and starting again?

F6 = One of the tail lights on the Western with Locksound V5 decoder, and 'buffer clash' on the Zimo in the 08. The Western was bought with sound fitted (to order) and the Zimo was supplied pre-set specifically for the Dapol 08 (round of applause to Coastal DCC there, the engine runs beautifully - it's my 'gold' standard' performer). According to readouts from both using Rocrail neither have any unexpected CVs set, or indeed cleared. The 'Drive Hold' (f12) doesn't do anything at all on the Western, but with sound on there is a delay before moving off (compared to sound off) while the brakes being blown off effect happens, then the engine revs but simultaneously it moves off (no further delay while the engine builds up some oomph - hence releasing f12 makes no odds like it should). It's no biggie, but I don't think I'll be paying the massive sound premium on already expensive models (O gauge) going forward.

[pete12345]

I remember an old RM article in which the builder constructed a sound board using modules from Trax Controls. The modules were hacked to replace the small pre-set potentiometers with full-size components which were mounted to the enclosure. This giving full control over volume, whistle pitch, "chuff" rate (to synchronise with different locos) and a left/right pan between two speakers. Very comprehensive and no doubt effective, but a little complex to operate.

[TimberSurf]

Without tapping into the control throttle and measuring the engine 'load', synchronisation will be nigh impossible. DCC does exactly that and you can also get a device that taps into the same signals to drive a big amp and speakers under the layout to boost the base!
With the advent of Blunami and HM7000 blue tooth control, you can achieve your wish without converting your layout to DCC, these devices are cheaper than traditional DCC Sound decoders, so may be comparable to the final cost of your DIY poor cousin!