Amunitions Factory

[Mountain]

Anyone considered modelling one of these? If one looks at the track plans of old sites like Pembrey (Now a country park with its beach), they are amazing. Standard gauge mixed with an extensive narrow gauge system along with many interesting buildings and tunnels leading to underground sections. While most of the site has been demolished with some structures were just covered over with sand/soil if they were too difficult to demolish (Usual gunpowder demolition methods were not an option for such a site with tons of cordite and TNT mixed into the sand particles!)
Fortunately some structures remain, the larger being tunnels with platforms in them. (One was used for a while to restore double decker busses but sadly they were vandalised, and one had a WW2 armoured car in it). Also some of the trackwork remains intact due to the fact that certain areas had track incased in concrete, including an impressive crossing between narrow and standard gauge.
Was told that underground sections had rails made from phosphorus bronze to prevent sparks. Workmen had hammers made from the same material.
During the height of production 40,000 people worked at the factory.

[Emettman]

I turned up a most impressive track plan here (link 2/3 down page)
http://www.discovercarmarthenshire.com/ ... index.html

It doesn't show it, but I suspect the sharp-curved track would be narrow gauge.
(need more data!)
I can see several sections which would make nice layouts as they stand.

The main problem would appear to be the standard gauge exchange sidings, which are so much bigger than everything else

Chris

[Mountain]

That is a copy of the original leaflet I have that was printed in the 1980's. It says the peak workforce was 3000 but in reality you can easily add another 0. Some accounts say 30,000. Some mention a peak of 40,000 workers. They didn't want too many claims from ex workers for compensation I guess as the chemicals used also had issues right into the early 1970's as the smaller local beach where us kids swam was known as the red pool as it was full of chemicals! One can imaging the conditions of working there! As much of the information about the area is still covered in secrecy, I've not been able to have much luck in finding the locomotives that worked there. The only one is a preserved loco of standard gauge origion that looks totally different to how it used to look due to later industrial use.

[Mountain]

The track plans are very impressive as they are in the form of a large trainset in itself! Tunnels, buildings... The lot!

[Bufferstop]

AS to the loco's, the standard gauge may have been allowed steam, but the narrow gauge would have probably been restricted to, petrol and diesel tractors like the WW1 Motor rail types, battery electric if it was flameproofed, stored compressed air and possibly fireless steam types. The latter two being charged/filled at the boilerhouse somewhere well away from the explosive/flamable stuff.

Fireless_loco.jpg (66.5 KiB) Viewed 2939 times

[Mountain]

Lovely fireless loco. Seen one of those outside a factory in Cardiff.
The only standard gauge loco I traced was a diesel.

[Mountain]

Thoughts along the lines of how I could make a small layout combining diesels for the ammunition works and yet allowing my lovely steam locomotives to make an appearance! Mmm. Thought needed!

[Bufferstop]

How about, include a section of perimeter fence with main line beyond. Steamers going past. In one side, some pause at signal, out the other?

[Mountain]

If the current layout I'm building wasn't so small! May need some thought. I mean small as I am turning my 7mm scale trains in a Loop in boards of just 2ft wide... Yes, the track plan does show tight curves but it is a lot to fit in 2ft x 7ft! Not impossible as I can model a section of it. Like you said... A perimeter fence...

[Emettman]

Thoughts along the lines of how I could make a small layout combining diesels for the ammunition works and yet allowing my lovely steam locomotives to make an appearance! Mmm. Thought needed!

How large can small go?
And how big are those steam locos?
For a double track oval for tender engines to pull 4+ coaches. you're looking at 5ft by 4ft as a probable minimum
Half the oval would be hidden, with the military rails mostly at a higher level.

To use less than that something less conventional will be needed.
Perhaps the minimum would be the side of an engine-shed as a backscene, and in front of that a turntable with a spur or two, locos coming and going from behind a coal loading bank. Say 4ft long, 15" wide at turntable end, 9" wide at loading bank end. The military railway as extra to that.

Chris

[Emettman]

Ah, I've just realised I may have mistaken the intended scales and gauges.
The above post was thinking of OO throughout, but with tight curves and restricted loading gauge for the munitions plant lines.

If mainline is O, and munitions 0-16.5, that would need another think.
Especially in regard to what O locos would be wanted to appear.

Chris

[Mountain]

I think I would concentrate on the narrow gauge bit. As I've not touched anything scenic yet I'm open to change ideas etc. I did have the plan for a light tramway type line with a tropical island feel rather then a UK or European based ammunitions factory. The thought came to me about changing plans. Nothing is impossible in theory but...... Haha. My thoughts seem to go wild until I look at the space. It doubled to 7 ft in length already when I took out a 180° loop at one end to allow for a second board...
My pointwork is home made and will fit in a tight space, but not the same design as M.O.D. track. I will say that M.O.D. track looks easy enough to make though. The old point levers are almost identical to ones used on Hornby Dublo 3 rail. I have lots of these! Got me thinking now!

[Mountain]

Also the pic Buffer stop put about the fireless loco makes me think of ideas.... We shall see.

[Mountain]

Thanks so much all who added to this post. Not sure if I can make a layout based on the idea yet, as I may need to wait to move house first so I can make a board with more room on it. 8'x8' would be nice!

[Emettman]

Thanks so much all who added to this post. Not sure if I can make a layout based on the idea yet, as I may need to wait to move house first so I can make a board with more room on it. 8'x8' would be nice!

A real railway (almost always) goes on for miles, so it's usually a matter of what has to get left out or squashed.

This was for OO, a dockside in 6x4. "Normal" locos could deliver goods to passing loop interchange, and run round, at 18" radius, but a couple of little short engines were needed to shunt all the the 10" radius dock curves.