New layout

[Mountain]

Thre only possible way to make it behave with a powercar at each end is to add weight to the coaches and upgrade wheels to a heavier metal type, do away with the couplings and use "Fixed" couplings in the formation so there are no sudden jolts caused by slack in the couplings. (Hence the need for fixed couplings).

I did hear that before the all wheel drive HST's came along, there were kits available to convert single end type to all wheel drive type powercars... And I also heard of one modeller who took what was then a new Bachmann class 25 (Or 24) and use the drive mechanism in the HST. One needed to alter the length of the drive shafts when doing this.

[Stokestation12]

Again, thank you all for your advice. I've got plenty to think about.

Just a little image of class 56 hauling the speedlink rake as it passes the class 20 with a short railfrright rake.

[aleopardstail]

something very nice about the lighting, must be a pain to actually work in but for the look of the thing its perfect for say an autumn evening

[Stokestation12]

Well...I might regret this decision...but I'm starting again!

After some extensive testing, I've decided that there are too many issues on the inner loops on longer trains and there's a few bits that don't sit right with me.

I will be removing the terminus section and effectively adding a middle line for freight. The inner curve will be dragged towards the edge of the board slightly, allowing enough room for a freight line to run through the middle.
I haven't measured fully, but I will be able to run the station at the same length and the tightest curve will be 5th radius, they will just start a bit sooner at each end.

Luckily, I have all of the track....just need time!

[aleopardstail]

Well...I might regret this decision...but I'm starting again!

After some extensive testing, I've decided that there are too many issues on the inner loops on longer trains and there's a few bits that don't sit right with me.

I will be removing the terminus section and effectively adding a middle line for freight. The inner curve will be dragged towards the edge of the board slightly, allowing enough room for a freight line to run through the middle.
I haven't measured fully, but I will be able to run the station at the same length and the tightest curve will be 5th radius, they will just start a bit sooner at each end.

Luckily, I have all of the track....just need time!

best bit about the whole thing being largely set track and no scenic stuff, dead easy to just get track down and experiment, far better to accept it and sort it early.

last time I had a loft layout it ended up 24'x13', I put the station across one end to have space just to watch trains run, wouldn't take the long stuff you have but was easier with the bulk being set track

[Stokestation12]

Well...I might regret this decision...but I'm starting again!

After some extensive testing, I've decided that there are too many issues on the inner loops on longer trains and there's a few bits that don't sit right with me.

I will be removing the terminus section and effectively adding a middle line for freight. The inner curve will be dragged towards the edge of the board slightly, allowing enough room for a freight line to run through the middle.
I haven't measured fully, but I will be able to run the station at the same length and the tightest curve will be 5th radius, they will just start a bit sooner at each end.

Luckily, I have all of the track....just need time!

best bit about the whole thing being largely set track and no scenic stuff, dead easy to just get track down and experiment, far better to accept it and sort it early.

last time I had a loft layout it ended up 24'x13', I put the station across one end to have space just to watch trains run, wouldn't take the long stuff you have but was easier with the bulk being set track

Yea I'm glad I hadn't set any scenary in as that would have been a big job!
I've been looking at it and there's lots of niggle things that I'm not happy with and it doesn't seem as busy as I wanted it to be. If I had the width on the bends, I would be adding a forth track but I don't think I will get away with it without sacrificing too much of the straight lengths. I've got to balance a station that van accommodate full rakes with wider curves to stop any slippage.

Plus, a middle track means my freight can just trundle along without taking up passenger train space on the platforms.

[aleopardstail]

a central "through" line is not that uncommon, ok normally a pair of them but just one works - only real issue is the space required for points, though if the third track goes all the way around with space its better.

"avoiding lines" are quite common.

also shows its well worth actually setting up and trying stuff before really sorting it. with Leopard Street I'm reasonably certain of the low deck plan, even so its getting tested for a few months when its powered up before the scenic stuff starts, both to test the actual track but also the concept while its not too early to adjust stuff.

big part of it is asking yourself what you actually want to do, by the sound of it for you its watching full length trains circulate more than fiddly shunting - or at least being able to have such trundle in the background.

and with the fiddle yard loops you have even with DC if you are interested some automation isn't that hard to do, just something that can stop and start a train and set the yard points so train one does a loop, then train two, then train three, then train one, or whatever. then you can just sit back and watch when you don't feel like driving

[Phred]

Stokestation12 wrote:
Well...I might regret this decision...but I'm starting again!

Best part about being the creator of your own little world, you can start again if it displeases you. And you don't even have to stage a flood to wash away the old stuff.

[Stokestation12]

I've had a look tonight and lifted on set of loops up.

I have had a little play and will just about get 4 lines!

The inner curve will be 4th radius and will feature the shorter passenger trains. Using the track spacer tool, I will then be able to have 5th & 6th radius in the centre and 7th for the outer passenger trains.

This will allow 1 fiddle yard siding per track so I will be able to swith between 2 trains on all tracks.

[aleopardstail]

don't know how many points you have, it may be worth investigating some of the PECO C100 Streamline stuff, for longer loops the closer track centres may be better, they are a bit longer though.

that said a quad track line works perfectly, with centre pair as "fast" and outer as "slow" or a pair of fast next to a pair of slow (the latter can be good if you want a yard but don't want a mass of points, former good if you want only a few lines for "stopping" services.

could also go for a twin track station and have "avoiding lines" behind it

[Dad-1]

I'd agree with aleopardstail, have a look at the Peco Streamline range.
I packed 6 lines onto a 12" wide shelf, would need slightly more spacing on some curves
my use was all straight, or very gentle curve.

However all about cost & availability. I used some set track because I had it, but now
regret not binning, or selling it and working 100% with Streamline & live frog points.

Geoff T.

[Bigmet]

The inner curve will be 4th radius and will feature the shorter passenger trains. Using the track spacer tool, I will then be able to have 5th & 6th radius in the centre and 7th for the outer passenger trains...

What distance does your 'track spacer tool' actually space the tracks at? You have sufficient space to abandon the set track radii and set out the curves at *50mm centre to centre spacing*, from whatever is the largest outside radius you can accomodate.

...it may be worth investigating some of the PECO C100 Streamline stuff, for longer loops the closer track centres may be better, they are a bit longer though.

*Definitely worth looking at, the running reliability of the medium and large radius points is very good indeed, and the Peco streamline points provide for this 50mm centres spacing.

Exactly as Geoff has suggested, the use of flexi track with live crossing points is very advantageous. Whatever, enjoy your project!

[Stokestation12]

The inner curve will be 4th radius and will feature the shorter passenger trains. Using the track spacer tool, I will then be able to have 5th & 6th radius in the centre and 7th for the outer passenger trains...

What distance does your 'track spacer tool' actually space the tracks at? You have sufficient space to abandon the set track radii and set out the curves at *50mm centre to centre spacing*, from whatever is the largest outside radius you can accomodate.

...it may be worth investigating some of the PECO C100 Streamline stuff, for longer loops the closer track centres may be better, they are a bit longer though.

*Definitely worth looking at, the running reliability of the medium and large radius points is very good indeed, and the Peco streamline points provide for this 50mm centres spacing.

Exactly as Geoff has suggested, the use of flexi track with live crossing points is very advantageous. Whatever, enjoy your project!

The distance tool is a 67mm centre to centre. I'll try the 50mm; I take it that would accommodate mk4s?

I've set out out the start of my curves as shown in this picture. With the curves starting here, I will still easily be able to accommodate a full rake of 10 mk4s in the station.

[Stokestation12]

A little look at the station layout

[Bigmet]

...The distance tool is a 67mm centre to centre. I'll try the 50mm; I take it that would accommodate mk4s?...

Check this on the smallest radius combination you plan to use with 50mm track centres spacing, using the actual vehicles. There's no substitute for 'suck it and see', as such questions are dependent on factors such as your own workmanship, the fidelity of the model and quality of its construction.

A further question is whether anything longer that you might want as a model on your layout is 'out there' or in devlopment. The real railway has had to deal with this many times over as traction and stock have increased in size.