New Stanier Black 5

Discuss Hornby Model Railway products and related topics here. This includes (Lima, Rivarossi, Jouef, Electrotren and Oxford Rail).
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Bigmet
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New Stanier Black 5

Post by Bigmet »

I see the Hornby model is now on sale, anyone yet taken the plunge? First the 'Hurrah!', overall a convincing model based on the pictures I have seen, the front end in particular looks way better than all previous versions. That's despite the clumsy light up headcode lamps 'feature', something will have to be done to them. This is one I will buy when the opportunity offers, as they were regularly seen off home turf. (Just a 'standard' Walschaerts gear job, in overall LMR filth brown 'livery', numbers and most of the paintwork concealed; as a child I genuinely thought this appearance was a livery choice, I never saw a clean loco at Snorbens or Watford, whereas the traction on the ECML was black or green, other than the heavy freight types which were in the LMR 'livery''.)

The question for me, will Hornby do the sensible thing and renew the other truly ubiquitous Stanier loco, the 8F? And maybe one or two other LMS designs that have never yet had a RTR OO model? There's the Stanier 3P 2-6-2T and Fowler'Austin 7' 7F 0-8-0 going begging. I expect all this hangs on the sales of the Black 5.
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centenary
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by centenary »

Seen a few YT vids where people have got their hands on this LMS version.

There's a bit too much silver on this model for my liking ie smoke box door hinges and driving wheel hubs and yes, I realise this loco was probably like that in 'real life.' I'll hang fire on this until the other livery versions are available before taking the plunge.

Reviews Ive seen appear to give it a big thumbs up.
Bigmet
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by Bigmet »

Locomotion now have a far more 'sober' version available, which looks way better. This is in 'as preserved' condition, LMS livery Black 5 as 5428 'Eric Treacy'. (This loco was only named after the LMS had long ceased to exist, whip off the plates, paint out the OHL warning flashes, to make a start on 'LMS-ing it'.)
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centenary
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by centenary »

Bigmet wrote: Sat Apr 27, 2024 11:58 am Locomotion now have a far more 'sober' version available, which looks way better. This is in 'as preserved' condition, LMS livery Black 5 as 5428 'Eric Treacy'. (This loco was only named after the LMS had long ceased to exist, whip off the plates, paint out the OHL warning flashes, to make a start on 'LMS-ing it'.)
Just pre ordered it from Rails! Wifey's birthday or Chrissie present depending when it is actually available! We rode behind 'Eric' a few years ago on the NYMR so yeah, ideal.
Bigmet
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by Bigmet »

The online discussion about the releases thus far is happily consistent:
Appearance and accuracy, most are satisfied, applies to both Walschaerts and Caprotti valve gear versions.
The front end light up lamps can be removed and replaced with the supplied lamp irons, delicate touch required.
Runs well, but too light for the full size trains they were regularly seen hauling.
Adding significant weight to increase traction is possible.
Hornby should be onto a winner with this item in short, and given the ubiquity of the class on the UK network 1935 - 67 and in preservation operation, hopefullly planning to sell both the variants within the class, and to long term exploit an array of name, number and allocation versions.
aleopardstail
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by aleopardstail »

the silver paint looks like plastic painted silver - however as a wargamer I am used to this and the fix is extremely easy (so long as you don't mind adding a bit of paint) - get a black was and paint into the recesses, adds a lot of depth and can very quickly remove the painted plastic look (a flesh colour does the same for painted brass, and a brown for painted copper)

it looks good, the reliability from some reviews and build quality lets down what appears to be a very good design - some of which can be worked around with a hint of weathering or taking the time to set the light configuration as you want then taking care to leave it.

not cheap, these days what is?

overall if I was modelling an appropriate ear/location I'd probably be wanting to get one, but would get it from a supplier it can be returned to if its got mechanical/electrical issues
crab
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Location: NZ

Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by crab »

So disappointed, I was looking forward to getting one of these for my period LMS layout. But after looking at several YT reviews, it appears the build quality is not up to the price. Having been caught out years ago with similar issues on Hattons Beyer Garrett and having to return that from NZ, I wont risk it again.
Bigmet
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by Bigmet »

crab wrote: Sat Jun 22, 2024 5:36 am ... having to return that from NZ, I wont risk it again.
And that is a risk that I too would find irksome. Very different from return directly to retailer, 15 minutes away.

It's doubly annoying in that Hornby have truly performed in 4-6-0 territory with a model that's right up there with Rapido's Stirling single, Hornby's B12/3 is a beauty. I'd grab a Black 5 to that standard, instanter! Instead for me it will be a wait for Hornby to get this model sorted. Every 'BR to end of steam layout' needs one, other than the Isle of Wight, and likewaise 'almost as isolated' locations; there should be plenty of subsequent production runs for Hornby to debug this item.
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centenary
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by centenary »

crab wrote: Sat Jun 22, 2024 5:36 am So disappointed, I was looking forward to getting one of these for my period LMS layout. But after looking at several YT reviews, it appears the build quality is not up to the price. Having been caught out years ago with similar issues on Hattons Beyer Garrett and having to return that from NZ, I wont risk it again.
Ive seen a lot of YT vids on this latest release but I cant remember any that slate the build quality. I saw one vid that in the reviewer's opinion stated the gap between loco and tender was too big. Ive seen a couple including Sam's Trains that had issues on DC with the power connector between loco on tender but this seems to correct itself on DCC (which is a bit strange). Sam always criticises price but the reality of the world today is models arent going to be priced cheaply.

Ive got Eric Treacy on pre order for wifey, which will be DCC'd so I'll see what it's like when it comes.
aleopardstail
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by aleopardstail »

loco to tender gap is always subjective, what looks right won't go round 2nd radius S curves, I doubt Hornby could release something unable to navigate their own pointwork and not yet seen a kinematic tender connection
Bigmet
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Re: New Stanier Black 5

Post by Bigmet »

aleopardstail wrote: Sat Jun 22, 2024 12:39 pm loco to tender gap is always subjective, what looks right won't go round 2nd radius S curves, I doubt Hornby could release something unable to navigate their own pointwork and not yet seen a kinematic tender connection.
Definitely has to work on settrack, that's a given. As I have chosen to do different by using flexitrack systems offering larger radii (but still not large enough!) pointwork, modification is the regular order of the day
The problem from my perspective is the loco to tender kinematic connections I have thus far seen recently (Hornby P2 and Bachmann V2) are functionally inadequate; and represent no advance over Bach's first malfunctioning effort on the N class 2-6-0 of 1998 or thereabouts. I have read that Accurascale have made a better job of a kinematic linkage on their Manor, but yet to see one.

The two immediate faults on both the V2 and P2:
Well overscale loco to tender separation on straight track and 'slop', which is a basic failure to exploit such a coupling correctly.
No restoration to straight ahead alignment on exiting curves, even with a light load.
So I have chopped them off and fitted rigid drawbars for scale loco to tender spacing, which much improves appearance of these otherwise decent models; and is OK for my 36" minimum radius layout.

It's a little strange as both Bachmann and Hornby are now over twenty years in, offering efficient kinematic couplings on bogie carriages, which with use of a suitable coupler will couple up with the Pullman gangways in contact on straight track, and open out to go around any curve the vehicles will negotiate individually, the ghastly crossover reverse curve formed by set track points included. (There is however a load limit on a 'ladder' of settrack crossovers, with fourteen carriages, derailment occurs reversing through four consecutive set track crossovers. But anyone with enough space for such a train length can probably fit in Peco medium or large radius points, and then there's no problem. 'Horses for courses' stuff...)
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