Peco Unifrog Points & insulated Rail Joiners

[centenary]

Im using Peco Code 75 OO scale Unifrog points on my DCC layout build. It's usually advised, if you use Peco electro frog points, that you do some wiring changes and use insulated rail joiners to prevent short circuits.

However, I wondered if insulated rail joiners were needed at all on the Unifrog. Peco have confirmed you do not need to use insulated rail joiners even on facing points, single or double slips due to the way the points are powered, particularly if you have frog polarity switching built into your point motors.

So, there you go!

[Bigmet]

In theory it's good, and since I hate Peco's kludgy insulated rail joiners with a passion, very welcome. Nevertheless I would test with selected examples of locos, and metal tyred wheels in rolling stock, if you are aware of any that have wide tyre profiles that are near cylindrical and might bridge the converging rails either side of the crossing.

A known offender among current product is Hornby's Brush 2 (30/31) which in addition to a near cylindrical tyre often has excessive side play in the wheelsets, unless washers are fitted to limit movement. Bachmann had some wide tyred tender wheels on their split chassis steam models, no longer in production but still readily available s/h. On wagons, Dapol managed a batch of cylindrical tyred wheels on the first release of the 6 wheel milk tank, of which I was recently reminded by some s/h wagons on which these had been substituted.

But it's mainly the discontinued product available s/h by such as H-D, Wrenn, Triang, Triang Hornby, Mainline, Airfix and Lima, where the problems can be lurking. A skilfully weathered Wrenn 'Blue spot' fish van came my way some months back, and without thinking about it overmuch I put it on the rails and gave it a push: it was very free running, went further than I expected and it shorted a unifrog point as it rolled over it, tripping the DCC system...

[Flashbang]

Im using Peco Code 75 OO scale Unifrog points on my DCC layout build. It's usually advised, if you use Peco electro frog points, that you do some wiring changes and use insulated rail joiners to prevent short circuits.

However, I wondered if insulated rail joiners were needed at all on the Unifrog. Peco have confirmed you do not need to use insulated rail joiners even on facing points, single or double slips due to the way the points are powered, particularly if you have frog polarity switching built into your point motors.

So, there you go!

IRJs (Insulated Rail Joiners) are not needed on the Peco Unifrog points. They have a built-in pair of IRJs. Of course, this only applies to Unifrog points and standard Elecrofrog points would normally have two IRJs fitted onto the ends of the Vee rails.

[centenary]

In theory it's good, and since I hate Peco's kludgy insulated rail joiners with a passion, very welcome. Nevertheless I would test with selected examples of locos, and metal tyred wheels in rolling stock, if you are aware of any that have wide tyre profiles that are near cylindrical and might bridge the converging rails either side of the crossing.

A known offender among current product is Hornby's Brush 2 (30/31) which in addition to a near cylindrical tyre often has excessive side play in the wheelsets, unless washers are fitted to limit movement. Bachmann had some wide tyred tender wheels on their split chassis steam models, no longer in production but still readily available s/h. On wagons, Dapol managed a batch of cylindrical tyred wheels on the first release of the 6 wheel milk tank, of which I was recently reminded by some s/h wagons on which these had been substituted.

But it's mainly the discontinued product available s/h by such as H-D, Wrenn, Triang, Triang Hornby, Mainline, Airfix and Lima, where the problems can be lurking. A skilfully weathered Wrenn 'Blue spot' fish van came my way some months back, and without thinking about it overmuch I put it on the rails and gave it a push: it was very free running, went further than I expected and it shorted a unifrog point as it rolled over it, tripping the DCC system...

Hi. Thanks for the heads up. However, I wont be using any 'old' stock with pizza cutter wheels. It's all nearly new stuff for me with the oldest being no earlier than 2018.

[TomTom]

In theory no, but if you are using them to access a siding both positions are powered so if a loco is stationed in a siding it is still going to move, unlike Electrofrog points, so an isolating section will be needed using an IRJ.

[Peterm]

I think I remember DCC Concepts having neater IRJ's than Peco. Might be worth a look if, like me, you're a belt and bracers man.

[centenary]

I think I remember DCC Concepts having neater IRJ's than Peco. Might be worth a look if, like me, you're a belt and bracers man.

Hi. DCC Concepts do not do IRJs for bullhead track, only their legacy FB code 75 rail. When I asked them, they said use cut down Peco IRJs if you need to use them on their bullhead.

Yes, in answer to Tom Tom, if you want to isolate a section of track so a section is unpowered, such as a siding, then you will have to use IRJs or make a clean cut in the track then install a switch to power \ unpower the section as required.

But that's not the scenario I described. My scenario didnt include rolling stock with pizza cutter wheels etc causing shorts. Rather facing points and to avoid short circuits when switching, were IRJs required. Peco's answer is they are not required since if your layout is correctly wired, Unifrogs themselves will not short circuit when switched.

[Bigmet]

In theory no, but if you are using them to access a siding both positions are powered so if a loco is stationed in a siding it is still going to move, unlike Electrofrog points, so an isolating section will be needed using an IRJ.

The move to points supplied as 'non-isolating' is supporting evidence that when it comes to 'methods for operating your OO railway', the reported turnover point to majority DCC sales has occurred.