N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

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ChrisGreaves
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N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

I solicit comments and discussion

Eyesight and finger agility are two counts against me.
This page is my current thinking on two proposed layouts using a 12vDC wind turbine battery store of wind-turbine power. The Landfall Garden House is a collection of domestic projects educational in nature. The 12vDC turbine has 40 suggestions for use of auxiliary power.

A colleague told me about Z-scale and then this morning T-scale.
I am not likely to build scenery as I did 60 years ago, but assembling a Toy Train Set ought to be within my capabilities.

(1) A 10-carriage rake running at as slow a speed as possible might look pretty good. The Newfoundland Bullet, like the Kalgoorlie Express, averaged around 25 mph, so assuming I have 80 feet point-to-point, that means about 7.25 miles at scale. I would want my "express" to take a quarter of an hour to crawl from the bedroom to the guest room.

(2) I see various voltages for these micro-scales, including 4.5 V DC for the T-gauge. I suppose that I can purchase a variety of transformers to supply, say, 4.5V DC from 12V DC

(3) My guess is that a DCC in T(1:480) is not feasible.

(4) I am assuming that Z- and T-scale provides powered locomotives, but maybe not. “The models are powered with a battery-powered throttle” suggests that they are powered.

(5) My proposed layout is ten modular 6’x6” layouts connected by single-line track. As always Joints will be important. Z/T scale may be too fine to support clean joints for the lift-out/in stations.

(6) The micro-scales will support smaller-radius curves than 00-scale, so a return (U-shaped) loop might fit onto a 12” board. My rooms are about ten feet square, so fitting a ninety-degree curve into the corners will reduce space by about 10% (a six-inch curve at each end of a ten-foot room)

(7) “One unusual side-effect of the magnetic wheels of the powered units is that they can climb acute grades (as steep as 45 degrees).” Suggests that I might be able to elevate the living-room section to the eye-level of a 5’6” pensioner. Or (Dare To Dream!) travel OVER doors to make a continuous run around a room.

(8) “In particular, the track must be kept clean, as minuscule particles of dust, dirt, or corrosion can easily stop locomotives”. I do not plan to run the model 24/7, only by appointment for visitors, so Perspex boxes for the 6’ stations and plastic sheeting over the single-track connections might reduce rail problems.

(9) Locomotive and rolling stock nationality would not worry me at all. I am thinking here only of demonstrating (and measuring!) one of forty uses of a 12v DC power supply.

(10) Modeling Scales (Wikipedia)

(11) Cost: I knew you would be asking. I suspect that a toy-train-set layout will be easy to specify as a bulk order for track and rolling stock. A huge cost, for sure, but I have to get rid of my money before I die (evil grin). That means a one-time cost of purchase and delivery, then start assembling and testing it all.

Thanks, Chris
Phred
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Phred »

Chris, your ideas are of such a level of complexity that they make my head hurt and bring on an urge to compensate by watching videos of funny cats. I will leave it to others with more flexible synapses to make suggestions.

I can identify with point 11 though, as I am also trying to arrange my affairs so that on the day of my passing I will be left with just two coins to place on my eyes (so that I may pay the ferryman).

Sorry I have no sensible ideas to offer but I do enjoy your posts, so I feel the need to reply. :)
Dad-1
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Dad-1 »

Uhhhhhh I can't see them, do they really exist ?
Although my rooms seem to have got bigger due to the far wall
becoming less clear I still can't find the space for 'O', strange ?

Geoff T.
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

Phred wrote:Chris, your ideas are of such a level of complexity that they make my head hurt ...
Phred, thanks for the reply.
How do you think my head feels? I have to live inside it 24/7 !! :lol:
I am glad you enjoy the posts. I expect this topic to be a gathering-point for folks considering scales other than 00-scale for use in what are essentially large starter train sets (round and around or point-to-point).

The fact that a bogie coach is only marginally larger than a weekly trimming of my thumb-nail doesn't worry me too much; I figure that I will kidnap one of the younguns who walk past my place each day to do the delicate finger-work of assembling a rake of carriages, and then that job is done. Also I would consider too hard-wiring the rake so that minor derailments do not result in uncoupling. If nothing else, the topic might serve as a collecting point for other considerations. Voltage is another example. Until yesterday I had assumed that all model railways 00- and smaller ran on 12vDC with 15vAC accessories. After all, it was that way in 1958 ... Now I see figures like 4.5v. Who Knew?

I am a long way off implementation, if ever, if only because I like to fill my retirement life with planning and pleasant activity. To that end I have a long list of "things it would be fun to do" in retirement, and my funicular railway is only partway done after two years; it sits there waiting for me to decide that it has become more fun than anything else I've been doing recently. My days are filled with pleasant activities, even if one or two are spent lying on the couch reading a book!

Cheers, Chris
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

Dad-1 wrote:Uhhhhhh I can't see them, do they really exist ?
Hi Dad-1.
Yes, they do exist, and maybe one day Real Soon Now when a windfall cheque arrives I will spend it on a starter-set, ordered perhaps from Japan, or Germany or wherever, and document the experience. After all, one penguin has to dive off the floe to see if there are any sea-lions hanging around!

If I set aside three days this summer (it is still snowing here) I might get the 12vDC turbine set up at ground level (for access to adjustment etc) and begin exploring a battery-bank of 12vDC and set about my applications. A starter-set would make for a ready-to-roll application without any hassle.

Part of the educational aspect of 12vDCV (for me) is measuring, measuring, measuring, so I want to document how many hours it takes to fully-charge a motorcycle battery here in Bonavista, how many hours running I can get off a full charge and so on.

Cheers, Chris
ChrisGreaves
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Marklin TV Extra 17 (Z-scale meeting)

Post by ChrisGreaves »

I found this YouTube video of what I think is a Marklin-Z users group exhibition from 2020.
Cheers, Chris
Phred
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Phred »

Dad-1 wrote:
Uhhhhhh I can't see them, do they really exist ?
The video link Chris posted would suggest Z exists anyway, but then again it could just be AI generated humbug designed to deceive us. :?
I wish my dodgy eyesight gave me bigger rooms. It just makes me more aware of the bloody-mindedness of inanimate objects waiting to trip me up. I once had a brick near my back fence which waited decades for the opportunity to injure me. When it finally succeeded, it just sat there as if nothing had happened while I limped away cursing.

@Chris
Putting the idle younguns to work on your railway is a good idea. They will only stray into a life of crime otherwise.
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

Phred wrote:
Dad-1 wrote:
Uhhhhhh I can't see them, do they really exist ?
The video link Chris posted would suggest Z exists anyway, but then again it could just be AI generated humbug designed to deceive us.
Hi Phred.
On what basis do you suggest that "Scale-Z" does not/might no exist?
If there was but one web page referring to "Scale-P" I would suspect a prank of some sort, but to my knowledge, there are multiple web pages and videos referring to Scale-Z, far too many web sites to suggest even an elaborate hoax.
The presence of a Wikipedia page in the search results gives added weight to the likely existence of Scale-Z
Thanks, Chris
Phred
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Phred »

ChrisGreaves wrote:
On what basis do you suggest that "Scale-Z" does not/might no exist?
Of course Z-scale exists. I've seen it with my own eyes! Just poking fun at the conspiracy theorists. :)
Phred
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Phred »

ChrisGreaves wrote:
Hi Phred.
On what basis do you suggest that "Scale-Z" does not/might no exist?
If there was but one web page referring to "Scale-P" I would suspect a prank of some sort, but to my knowledge, there are multiple web pages and videos referring to Scale-Z, far too many web sites to suggest even an elaborate hoax.
The presence of a Wikipedia page in the search results gives added weight to the likely existence of Scale-Z
Thanks, Chris
Oh, that was a joke, wasn't it? Ooh, my head's hurting again... :oops:
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Mountain
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Mountain »

I would personally look to a larger scale and if space is an issue try narrow gauge.
My models are made to turn round on a 2ft wide board and a loco and five coaches take up a siding length of only 3ft long, and that is in 7mm scale. Admittedly the coaches and loco are of the short 4 wheel variety, but it is a scale that is just large enough to listen to the little metal buffers clashing and where manual uncoupling and coupling takes place without it being too small and intricate for this to be done.
But whatever scale and gauge one is looking at, is a good idea to give it a try buy buying secondhand, so if one does not like it, one can sell it on without making too much of a loss.
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

ChrisGreaves wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 11:18 am I solicit comments and discussion
I found what must be surely the world's smallest T-gauge layout.
If I have understood the video, the track circle is a mere 1cm radius.

Now that would mean NO EXCUSES from anyone about "not having enough room for a room-to-room layout.
Cheers, Chris
Bigmet
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by Bigmet »

ChrisGreaves wrote: Sun Nov 19, 2023 10:22 pm I solicit comments and discussion... the world's smallest T-gauge layout... NO EXCUSES from anyone about "not having enough room...
Unfortunately, every example of running T- gauge I have seen triggers the thought 'electric cockroaches'. Perhaps it is just me, but I find this an inhibiting thought.
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

Bigmet wrote: Mon Nov 20, 2023 3:26 pm... triggers the thought 'electric cockroaches'. Perhaps it is just me, but I find this an inhibiting thought.
Bigmet, I partly agree (which is just a nice way of saying that I don't (totally) agree with you!)

Part of me thinks that yes, they might look like high-speed slugs darting around the room.
On the other hand, many of these YouTube videos express surprise at "the attention to detail", and I must suppose that today's savvy manufacturers have better methods than Triang of 1959.

My main thought right now is that if one were sitting in the Living Room and a train rolled along the western wall and disappeared into a tunnel (a.k.a.the next room), only to re-appear in a minute or two, with no other activity seen or heard, then it might appear as if the 14:20 southbound had almost crossed with the 14:15 northbound. I am not sure that I could be trusted to repaint one side of a T-scale train in a different colour. :oops:

While close-up the accuracy of detail might be lacking something, the appearance as a small part of a much wider landscape would be realistic.

Our minds are somewhat saturated with close-up views of a layout, either in real life or as a video, but consider The Newfie Bullet which was basically a single track crossing 880 Km of barren land. It would be invisible to the naked eye! So much for detail!!

I just know that I have to buy that Intercity Starter Set and enough spare track to run along one wall ...
Cheers, Chris
ChrisGreaves
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Re: N(1:160), Z(1:220) and T (1:480) scale for old-age pensioners

Post by ChrisGreaves »

And while we are still on-topic (grin) I found this little video which makes me wonder if the "T-" doesn't stand for Third rail. :twisted:
Cheers, Chris
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