A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Discussion of model railway baseboard design and construction
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Dad-1
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A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

In My Derry's Yard thread I mentioned the possibility of making another shunting layout.
One where I already have space, but upside down. Can it be converted ???

The initial plan, and be warned this may never happen.
I have Derry's Yard a small shunting loop. This has been designed to stand on it's end to
drastically reduce the storage space required. The dimensions are 12" deep, 7.1/2" high and 49.1/2" long.
Because this is stored standing on it's end it required adequate top protection from accidental damage. To
that end a thin ply lid was made and hinged all along the back, originally I thought that would be fine, but,
ahh, there are always lot's of But's. Although even lowered to the back it only requires a little over 24" it's
proving to be a space consuming nuisance. I'm now planning to remove the hinge, holding the lid in place by
dowels along the hinge line and clamping into place with 4 latches.

So what do you do with a lift off lid ??
Can another shunting puzzle be built into it ?
Yes I have no doubts, then another But, the outside of the lid must have no protrusions, wires, or anything
to detract from the smooth exterior. All component parts on the inside need to clear all existing layouts scenery.

It must be DCC fully wired, It must be for Kadee operation, but not with above sleeper magnets and I will
be using the Kadee under track magnets. This will mean that all tracks will need to be built on thin wooden laths
that will give enough room to slide the magnets into appropriate gaps under the tracks.
I've checked my code 75 stock and don't have what will be needed. So do I make with code 100 track of which
I have loads, or perhaps make my own pointwork ? I have several boxes of SMP straight track.

Remember this is ideas only at the moment.

Outside of the lid :-
Image

That space shouting out to be used :-
Image

I enjoy a challenge !!! Sometimes.

Geoff T.
Dad-1
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

Mornin' All,

As I had to sit in a hospital waiting room yesterday (wife off colour) I was thinking about
names. I always think you need a name to help with mental development of what may be
required within a layout.

Lydd Top Sidings - Fruit vans, Hops ?
Lydney Wood - Forest of Dean, coal, fruit ?
Topsham Quay - Fish vans & general freight ?

All following my established layouts pattern. For anyone who find this baffling here are some
earlier names and why.
Two Short Planks, later with A Bit On The Side. A layout on two shelf boards, with a bit added later to one side.
St Oval, Literally a Set-track oval
HSII , Happy shunting design 2
Derry's Yard, Made from track and using wagons inherited from Derry Thompson
Thomas & Friends Visit Bride Bay, A 'Thomas' the tank engine layout incorporating a beach and we live near the River Bride.
Castell Mawr, simply means large castle in Welsh, my castle in the air that's now a white elephant.

Ahh and all 6 are still available for use, although Castell Mawr is too big to use at home & needs a small team.

Geoff T.
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Lofty
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Lofty »

Lydd Top Sidings
Simply brilliant 8)
Once upon a time I built a model railway in the loft. Now I dabble on much smaller baseboards.
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Bufferstop
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Bufferstop »

Lydd Top gets my vote too, location totally non specific! It was a lid like that, which fitted my then fiddle yard that got me into lightweight baseboards. The lid turned out far lighter and still more rigid than the board it was intended to cover!
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Dad-1
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

Thank you both,
I think it'll become "Lydd Top Sidings"

Today I had my box of Peco live frog points out and was struggling to get what I fancy.
In addition to the two point 3 siding Classic Inglenook I'd like a small corrugated tin loco
shed. The traction will be small, to very small, locos with perhaps a 6 wheel Sentinel
being the largest. That brings me to home made live frog points where I don't have to
keep to the recognised commercial geometry, in fact I could make a Set-track type, or
even variable curved point.

My next move is to find my roll of lining paper, mark out the exact size with shaded areas
where fouling could happen with existing scenic items. Then draw in a plan, one I could
then make ??? Having copper-clad sleepering and lots of track why not ?

I also though it would be possible to run the two layouts NOT CONNECTED, but side by side
using a Siamesed track power connection, powered through my Zephyr express and separate
hand controller ??

Geoff T.
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by ChrisGreaves »

Dad-1 wrote: Remember this is ideas only at the moment.
Hi Geoff.
I am not clear on how you plan to deal with wiring and other under-the-board topics, but I assume that you would prefer to hide those things.

I think that you will have two crates, each with a model, and the two crates come together so that one is the "box" and the other is the "lid".
Can you build the layout on a board with, say, two-inch legs at the corner, so that the layout board can be lifted out of the box for under-board work, and then gently lowered back into is box.
Rather like a false-suitcase floor, about which I know nothing.

I reason that you would need some way of anchoring the boards to the sides of the boxes - perhaps some sort of swivel-peg that slides into grooves on the side of the box?
Cheers, Chris
Dad-1
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

Hi Chris,

Only able to spend some time thinking today.
Wiring not a problem as that can be underneath the track edges and fully enclosed in ballast.
The difficult one is how to work the points, probably 3 of them. It could be done by above board
point motors, but that will need a switch deck and power. More likely is mechanical rod working,
something I've used several times before, but this time I won't have suitable space for mechanical
frog polarity switching. In one case I have relied on the switch blade to stock rail contact to carry
current, not ideal, but my one application still functions well after around 7 years.

The existing Derry's Yard is fine standing alone as it is.

The Top will simply be unlatched and lifted off, if not to be used simply stood aside, under a table,
or even on end. However if to be used it will stand on what is normally the top. It will have some felt
'feet' stuck on the strengthening framework I'll be adding using 5.0 mm strip wood to reinforce the
current front & back frame.

Somehow I need to introduce track power, probably into a 2.1 DC socket fitted into a front corner, only
seen when lifted off. No lighting or anything fancy. I did rest a 3 way point on a paper template, but don't
fancy using that, not that they're not reliable, just visually not right.

The current thinking is to try to draw a track plan on paper. Then fully understand how that can be built,
including points and all. It took me ages to get my head around a DCC hand made scissor crossing. It
can be done, but can I do it ??

A tentative step was to order 4 under track Kadee magnets. More thinking when they arrive.

Geoff T.
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Bufferstop
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Bufferstop »

If you can spare a few mm of headroom, cover the surface with 4mm MDF and cut slots in it to bury push rods for operating the points, I'm sure you can come up with disguised handles for them as innovative as the parked vehicles were. It might even be possible to incorporate the very smallest microswitches available for frog switching (another slot to contain the wires). When I was experimenting with a baseboard made from HD insulating foam (Kingspan) I sharpened the end of a piece of 5mm copper tube and found that you could bore a straight hole from the front or back of the block into a pit where the point was to go for push rod or wiring. I adapted the method from the one we developed in the 60s for getting cables under tarmac or concrete footpaths that had been laid days early according to the schedule we'd been given, but that was more like a length of scaffold tube with the application of a sledgehammer!
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Phred
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Phred »

Bufferstop wrote:
a length of scaffold tube with the application of a sledgehammer
Reminds me of my time labouring for the Postmaster General's Department laying pipes for telephone cables. I spent many a day bashing galvanised iron pipes under obstructions with a sledgehammer. Not nice in the Queensland heat but then there was no WHS so most of us didn't wear shirts, much less any sort of protective clothing. Some didn't even wear shoes!
Dad-1
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

The Lydd is now off.
The reinforcing along what will be the front just resting in place
while I try various possible track plans.
I want to include a classic 3 siding inglenook, but with a short spur
for a corrugated tin engine shed.
I'm concerned that the Kadee magnets are 6 mm thick, this means all the trackwork
has to be raised that much. The problem it's going to bring is that it will probably foul
the yard lights on Derry's Yard .... the layout this is the cover of !!

Here I am working with a 3 way point

Image



Geoff T.
Dad-1
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Re: A space found - Some interesting design requirements

Post by Dad-1 »

This has been hiding in a corner while I finished "Chalkhill" ready for the end of the Month.

As shewn already I hadn't worked out what to do regarding the track layout. As I've recently
made a crossover pair of points in code 75 I've decide this will have just home made points.
Any straight track will be SMP fine scale track of which I have quite a lot.
This was trying ideas as I have no prepared layout plan, or even ideas other than point changing
will be by manual rod with built in magnetic latching - exactly how is still in the ideas realm.
A couple of pictures to follow.

*** Here. Taken a few days to get back to this.

Image

Image

So that is the space, the plan as with my plonked stock. Using the following pointwork.

Image

Image

That last point is by far the best I've made so far, not only that but I've thoroughly enjoyed
making it. Did the final live testing today (20th) just a few rags on the copper-clad that needed
removing, nearly always the occasional short.

Geoff T
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