LMS short wheelbase coaches?

[craziej2k]

Does anyone know if the LMS ever used any short wheelbase coaches? I've seen shorter than normal ones for the GWR and was curious if any other companies used them?

[flying scotsman123]

They would have inherited short bogie, 6 wheel, and a few 4 wheel coaches from their constituent pre-grouping companies (LNWR, MR, NSR, FR, CR, HR, GSWR etc.) but to my knowledge they didn't build anything shorter than the standard 57' for passenger carrying coaches. Inherited 4 wheel coaches were really on their last legs by the grouping in 1923, a finger in the air guess would say 6 wheel coaches would be a definite rarity by 1930ish, while pre-grouping bogie coaches could have lasted until the early 1950s.

When comparing with the GWR remember that they were both a pre- and post-grouping company, so they existed many years before the LMS was even thought of.

[Bufferstop]

Try the wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coaches_o ... sh_Railway.
Remember that coaches have a relatively long life and the LMS was formed by the amalgamation of the LNWR, Midland, Caledonian, Lancs and Yorks Furness etc. By the time the LMS was formed there would have been no new 4 and 6 wheel coaches, but plenty of older (shorter) designs from the constituent companies. I can remember brass "Works Plates" in the door frames from both LNWR and Midland which had lasted some time into BR days by the time I could read them! The non corridor stock I can remember was somewhat shorter than the corridor stock which were the basis for the BR Mk1 designs.

[Bigmet]

Does anyone know if the LMS ever used any short wheelbase coaches? I've seen shorter than normal ones for the GWR and was curious if any other companies used them?

The LMS had a large stock of inherited bogie coaches from its many constituents, most of which it would hand on to BR, for scrapping as the BR mk1 build displaced the oldest, or the steady reduction in BR's passenger traffic volume rendered them redundant. I happen to know that the GSWR had 43' bogie coaches which looked very dinky indeed, because a friend built some. However the most common long term survivors were the ex-LNWR 50' and ex-MR 48' designs, for the simple reason that these two companies together had the greatest passenger traffic in the UK, what with serving London and northward through the Midlands and North West, where the majority of the UK population were (and are) located; and thus needing a lot of passenger stock.

The LMS was still cheerfully operating four wheelers inherited from the NLR for the first 10 years of its existence, if you want really short. These worked onto the East Coast main line (then LNER) with a 3F 'Jinty' on the front, terminating at Potter's Bar (Which destination was determined by how long the steam would last out on a LMS pregroup design loco small enough to be permitted to work out of Broad Street, and even the mighty Stanier couldn't manage anything better. Everyone was greatly relieved when the outbreak of WWII could be used to rationalise the rail services for North London commuters, and the traffic passed to the puissant Gresley N2 'Big Metropolitan' tank which made easy work of it.)

[Lysander]

If you are wishing to build some, the Ratio kits for the ex-Midland suburban bogie coaches are fairly short and Keyser produced a range of short ex-LNWR 6-wheelers which, although of few parts in white metal and fairly basic, do make up into nice models with care. Here's one for eg:



Tony

[NickHolliday]

In 1921 the Caledonian Railway built a number of 4 wheeled coaches, around 30 feet long, for services on the Balerno branch, and some of them survived long enough to receive BR numbers. Full information about them can be found on the Caley Coahces website. http://www.caleycoaches.co.uk/assets/pdfs/balernoPn.pdf

[21C1]

The LMS took over a number of 50' coaches from the LNWR which lasted into BR days - some available as kits from Ratio. Similarly they inherited some 48ft clerestory coaches from the Midland - some also available as kits from Ratio. These lasted until just before nationalisation. There were also some short 54' and 51' LMS non-corridor coaches. These all are shown in Historic Carriage Drawings" vol 2 by David Jenkinson if you can find a copy.

[craziej2k]

Thanks for the replies everyone! I'm looking to get some for my layout in the future at some point which was why I was asking.

[Mountain]

It is a fun idea! It is surprizing how long certain stock lasted and why not? If they still are safe to use and serve a purpose then it makes perfect sense to use them.
Usually things like this will find their way to the furthest parts of the railway network where traffic demands were less and passenger numbers were lower than elsewhere. The type of line which survived on old stock because it never generated sufficient trade to warrant buying or building fresh new stock.
While standard gauge lines did this, narrow gauge lines did this even more! Was a case of "It works. What more do you want?"