7mm Narrow Gauge For Beginners.

[Mountain]

Making a start in 7mm narrow gauge may not be as daunting or difficult as one may think.
Here are three useful kit manufacturers that make relatively simple kits.

http://www.422modelmaking.co.uk.

http://www.smallbrookstudio.co.uk

http://www.peco-uk.com

My advice is to start by buying a budget little Hornby 0-4-0 trainset with a loco that has piston rods and pistons. The track can be used and the loco, and the wagon or 4 wheel coach chassis can be used (Mineral wagons and some others can be used as they are if one wants. Be aware that chassis can be cut in two to form sub chassis and filed to fit under coach or waggon kits so they can all come in useful. I have done this with a short wheelbase Hornby wagon chassis which is glued underneath one of my Smallbrook Studio 4 wheel coach kits as I did not have a suitable Dapol chassis which was recommended to be used at the time).

For beginners I recommend keeping to either the resin or pladtic kits. So for locos I would go for a Smallbrook kit, for coaches I would use any of the three manufacturers for coaches. Peco plastic coaches are pre coloured so no painting is required unless one want to paint them. For waggons I would go for Smallbrook or 422, though Peco vans are plastic so are suitable for beginners and I believe there larger mineral wagon is plastic too? (Check before buying). I am not saying one can't buy one of the whitemental kits. I am just saying that it is easier to start with plastic or resin.
My main recommendation in regards to loco kits is to make sure you have, or can get a suitable donor loco or chassis that can be used with the kit before you buy one just incase you may end up dissapointed. The little Hornby 0-4-0's are plentiful enough even if one has to use an older chassis that goes at 200mph! Haha. (Use the speed knob on the controller to slow it down. That's what its for! ). The newer versions have been modified to run at slower speeds and are lovely. But as long as you have a chassis that fits you are ready to buy the kit. Coach and waggon kits are less of an issue as one can usually get or adapt something to fit. The only possible difficulty is if the kit needs very small wheels. Most use standard 00 gauge 12.5 mm wheels (Or 12.6) so are fine.
Track. You can use standard 00 gauge or Peco 0-16.5 track or a mix (As long as it is code 100 to get the same rail height)). Your choice. 00 gauge sleepers can be hidden under ballast if required. You can't go wrong!
Well. What are you waiting for? Off you go and start building! Enjoy and good luck!

[pete12345]

Some good ideas here. One thing that comes to mind is to make a 2-4-0 or 0-4-2 locomotive by adding half a wagon chassis to form the leading/trailing axle. With careful positioning even the original wagon coupling could be used. With some plasticard and the original body as a donor, a decent-looking freelance loco can be built.

[Mountain]

Yes. 0-4-2 would seem to be the easiest. One would need to adapt the chassis a little and use small wheels. It maybe best to make a kind of floating pony for the rear wheels so if one had sharp curves it will work round them.
The beauty is that with narrow gauge, they dis a lot of adapting and converting locos to suit their individual needs. One of the Tal-Y-Llyn locos started off as an 0-4-0 and was converted into an 0-4-2 if I can remember my Tal-Y-Llyn Railway history correctly.
I did have mental plans to use parts from 0-4-0's to build a short wheelbase 0-6-0, though one would need to build a new chassis, as I quite like the design of the 0-4-0 wheels.
I also have another plan to customize the wheels a little on one of my 0-4-0's.

The good thing about freelance modelling, is it is your own little railway so you can decide what you want to do to it. It is liberating and gives a feel much like the origional railway builders must have felt when they were building a new line. They had limited funds just like se often do. Many had limited space in where they could put their lines so they needed to find solutions. Some lines needed sharp curves and quite severe gradients. Some were split into different levels with inclines. Many lines were horsedrawn because horses could tow a couple of little waggons a time (Depending on weight) up a 1 in 4 gradient as a horse could get traction where locomotive wheels couldn't. Far cheaper then a rack railway which was really a bit of a novelty compared to the much cheaper solutions of using horses or cable inclines.

Whichever method used, it was all about taking someone or something from place A to place B, which is something we can feature well in model form.

[pete12345]

I guess it's one of those situations where a 'mystery box' of random/broken loco parts would be useful. A chassis from here, leading truck from there (any Hornby 4-6-0 for example) a boiler from here, plus assorted plasticard and "no idea what that's from" parts. Great fun!

[Mountain]

That's the idea. And as there are many bits and pieces available in both 00 and H0 scales which one can use in 7mm narrow gauge, and depending on the curves one uses a 4-6-0 is certainly a possibility. I tend to use 0-4-0's and shorter 0-6-0's because my curves are tight.
I may have mentioned before that I make my own couplings to save costs and they are simple enough to make. (The black waggons. Not finished making the drop loop on one of these black waggons).
Also a picture of a waggon made from lollypop sticks and tea sturers (The tatty dark grey one. Not started making couplings and buffers for this one yet).

I include these just to show that most people can build something, even if one is a complete beginner. It is surprizing what can be done without too much skill or expense.

[pete12345]

I messed around a few years ago building some wagons like that. An open wagon, van and tanker if I remember right.

I'd like to see a working cable railway on a model! Perhaps one wagon permanently attached to each end of the cable to simplify things (company rules require a brakeman in case of cable failure!) and an uncoupler at the bottom so the loco can draw the train away. Maybe even a single line with passing loop halfway for the engineering challenge.

[Mountain]

Something that may help those who are used to 00 and wanting to try 7mm narrow gauge and the space saving and budget qualities it offers.

Train lengths.

If one keeps to the Hornby 0-4-0's as donor locos, and one keeps to shorter 4 wheels coaches...

Two locos take the same length as a larger 00 gauge diesel (E.g. a class 45 or 46, or a class 37 or 47, which is about the same length as an average 00 gauge steam locomotive with its tender).

Two shorter 4 wheel coaches from either Peco, Smallbrook Studio or 422 are about the same length as a single 00 gauge bogie coach.

I can fit a loco with its five coach train in the same length as a 3 car DMU in 00, or an average loco and two coaches so train lengths in 7mm narrow gauge need not be too long, so layouts can fit in small spaces if needed.

If suitable couplings are used, trains can turn on a 2ft wide board as long as the stock is built to a relatively short wheelbase. (Think of those Hornby trainset style 4 wheel coaches and they are similar length to the 7mm narrow gauge 4 wheel coaches by Peco and Smallbrook Studio. 422 are a tiny bit longer but not by much. If turning on a 2ft wide layout, I would not use longer coaches unless they are bogie coaches but be aware that bogie coaches need to be relitively short due to overhang clearances etc. 0-6-0's either need to have short wheelbases, or they will need their central wheel flanges removed so they will act like an 0-4-0 while taking corners.

The general max width of vehicles is only about an extra cm each side compared to 00 so will not usually present any problems. The height is an extra coupe of cm, but not as high as one would think. The photo shows two of my locos next to a 00 gauge loco. The loco in the middle is the same width as the 00 gauge Smokey Joe 0-4-0, and the green loco on the left is wider.

I put this information up as a guide to show the potential that 0-16.5 has, and how it may provide answers to space starved modellers who may find that N gauge is a bit small.

0-16.5 uses the same track width as 00 so one can use 00 track,wheels etc if one desires.

[Daniel]

Good post, Mountain.

I've built a couple of 7mm n.g. layouts, some with handmade (not by me) 200mm radius points.
An important advantage above my current 1/32 modeling was that 7mm n.g. is more popular and that made a lot easier to sell when one wants to move on and start a new layout.(I've sold three very fast)

There are plenty of sources for all kind of materials from the 1/48, 1/45 and 1/43,5 scales but also a lot perfectly usable from h0 and 00. For example the beautiful 'diamond' boguies made by RATIO wich look perfect under 7mm n.g. wagons, coaches and tenders.

If my eyes could afford it, 7mm n.g. would be my choice still now.

Daniel

[Mountain]

The good thing about 7mm narrow gauge using 16.5mm gauge track is that there is no shortage of potential parts and models to convert without it costing too much. Naturally one can easily spend a fortune in anything if one so desires and can afford it, and I have seen some lovely finescale kits out there for those who have the funds and the patience to build them. I stick to both scratchbuilding and simpler resin and the odd plastic kit simply because I find them easier though I have been given two nice looking etched brass body kits from someone I know which do need me to make a start on them.

The reason why I re-visited this part of the site is that I was looking at some lovely little waggon kits that are not that expensive to buy. They are the type and size of kit which is very suitable for small space saving layouts like mine. These little waggons are only around 4 to 5cm long at a guess, so it is possible to make rakes of these without them taking up that much space. All things that are important when getting the balance right. We have all seen tail chasing layouts which have more train in the oval then free track space leaving the viewer think of those fun kiddie fairground rides that some of us enjoyed in the '70's but does not do much to make the scene believable. But short little 4 wheel waggons by 422, Peco, Smallbrook and others mean that the scene looks right even though there may not be that many of them. Who remembers scenes like the old pictures of one of the old Tal-Y-Llyn locos trundling along with two small 4 wheel slate waggons and the space they need on the rails is very little indeed. If one chooses to use space saving couplings which close the gap between vehicles one is looking at two short waggons taking up a space similar to a typical 00 gauge waggon, and two little 4 wheel narrow gauge coaches will take up a similar space as an average single bogie 00 gauge coach.
Naturally if one wants to run longer stock one can, but what I am saying is that as long as one does not get too adventurous and one keeps to sensible sized locos and rolling stock, the space requirements of 7mm narrow gauge can be very small indeed and some of these kits really do assist one in adding to the space saving theme along with them not costing too much... And if they are over ones budget, scratchbuilding something similar is not going to be that difficult.

(Photo shows a rake of mostly unfinished scratchbuilt waggons which are based on the size of Triang early coach or wagon bogies... The first three rusty waggons on the right are using old Triang bogies as underframes!)

[Mountain]

Just to add to this thread so one can get an idea of the possibilities that one has to play with, there is an option to directly convert surplus 00 gauge wagons. Examples of this can be seen on the internet especially on Ebay and elsewhere where clever individuals enjoy converting old 00 gauge stock to sell on to narrow gauge modellers and as long as one likes what one sees and is happy with the price, why not? (Though bear in mind one may need to change the couplings if one uses a different type, but this is not going to be too much of a problem for many of you tallented people I hope?)