Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

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Chops
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Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Chops »

I have two brand new units, manufacturer's name withheld, that are pending a one way trip to the dust bin. My passion for British OO is well matched by the exorbitant shipping costs, so I either choose wisely or get stung. Not much chance of returning a dodgey product, as it only doubles the shipping fees.

Poorer, and wiser, I now check out every item on Sam's Reviews first. That alone has saved money and disappointment. The fellow is most methodical and pulls no punches. It would be of little wonder if someday a flower pot beans him mysteriously or if he simply vanishes entirely, like Jimmy Hoffa. If you haven't seen his website, you're in for an eye opening treat.

Any rate, I've been yearning for a skirted streamline rail coach for the past year. Sam's reviewed both Hornby and Dapol, but the Dapol one has the unusual skirting, and it got a decent review. Anyone have any experience with this piece? Has it continued to function as it did when you bought it?

I have two brand new pieces that didn't survive a matter of hours. I have elderly Triang pieces that run nicely. But they were made in Britain.

Advice please.
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Bufferstop
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Bufferstop »

I've got the Dapol number 12, no problems with it, runs smoothly I think the top speed is around 60 scale mph which is about right, can't test the haulage power as it has no couplings, they did however pull the odd trailer coach. No 17 or 18 the last of the curvy ones had a matching driving trailer built for it. Two pairs of the later more angular ones were built as 2 car DMU's and were (mechanically at least) the prototypes for the post war first generation DMU's.
Young SAM got it wrong when he criticised them for the Big brown box next to the door which he thought hid the motor. It's actually a representation of the prefabricated toilet cubicle which was installed in some of them, it's a bit lacking in detail as it was an afterthought and never ended up amongst the drawings. I have seen some crticism of their reliability but people always complain about things going wrong but rarely write in to say it's going ok.
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Chops
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Chops »

Thank you for that, I shall purchase one from Rails of Sheffield, which gets pretty good marks around here. I am well pleased that I will now possess
a prefabricated toilet box. There are not many people on this side of the Pond who can lay claim to such an achievement. I noted that the other box
indicated a minimum of second degree radii, and so it will be designated to Henley's outer loop, which is the down line. Or the Up line. Or the down-up-lateral line. Oh never mind. But thank you, I have wanted one for a year now, time to pull the trigger. Sorry, that's a local idiom. In Canada, it would be said that it is "time to whisk the broom afore the curling iron." Doubt I will be making it to the UK this year, unless the new Virus will not sack me.
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Mike Parkes
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Mike Parkes »

Mr Youtube sensations knowledge is sparse at the best of times and their is one preserved railway model shop who have very dim views of him having had to repair locos he has serviced. I find it quite hilarious how he can criticise the performance of a model when he has first taken it apart and possibly not reassembled it right. The EFE Beattie Well Tank that he when overboard in criticising is a Dapol originated model dating from 2011 and at that time the use of diecast running plates etc was very rare; his judgement of whether a model is good or not seems to depend on the extent of metal in it to the point of overlooking practicalities - his critic of the Bachmann Midland 0-4-4T that it would be better with metal side tanks and boiler overlooks the fact that 0-4-4Ts are difficult to balance and all that weight would have been an interesting balancing exercise possibly requiring more weight with consequential implications for increased wear on mechanical parts through increased power needed just to move itself. He also seems to a complete misunderstanding of how many vehicles the real loco of model could pull and takes any loco as only being able to pull only a few coaches as being poor despite that number being prototypically correct. What are the two models you are having problems with?
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Mountain
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Mountain »

I hope your new models can be sorted. Postage to and from the USA wont be cheap from here but it is much cheaper then trying to take the things back in person!
Uhmmm. These days I do prefer to pick older designs of mechanism that I know can be easily repaired for my 7mm narrow gauge because modern models can be to me a bit of a risk not knowing if they will be good or not. I have been soo scared off with the mazak rot issues that some have had, and other little design issues, and the prices of these newer models, that I really don't want to take the risks unless I know the models can survive to be with me in the future.
I stick with those little Hornby 0-4-0's if I can, as they are lovely, and even if most of mine have a high top speed (Less so with heavy Smallbrook bodies), I do not mind quite so much if I know that they will be relatively reliable and easy to fix when things go wrong.
I do sympathize with the manufacturers because for them it is a juggling act and it can't be easy, and one can test and test and test prototype models, but it is not until they reach the public, that things can go wrong. (I used to find that with bicycles... Where the top mountain bike riders would thrash them and they would be ok, but as soon as the public had them, no matter how well set up they were leaving the shop... It is how it is. The real testing ground for anything is to sell them to the public and have the things rattle along on long postal journeys etc... Haha).

But anyway. Lets hope that whatever issues your models have can be fixed without any difficulty.
Is the issue electrical or mechanical?
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Lysander
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Lysander »

Inexplicable double post.

Tony
Last edited by Lysander on Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Lysander
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Lysander »

A review of the railcar from the time it was released, with photos and some background. It really is a nice model.

https://srmg.org.uk/news-blog/2017/11/6 ... ing-banana

Tony
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Chops
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Chops »

Very interesting perspectives, all. The two units, I've inquired with various repair depots in the UK and no one is interested in taking them on.
I've tried Peter's Spares and the necessary parts are obsolete.
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Bigmet
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Bigmet »

Chops wrote:... Doubt I will be making it to the UK this year, unless the new Virus will not sack me.
Once you are vaccinated, and our lockdown is lifted, shouldn't be a problem.

If you want or need to visit the UK, in your shoes I would order for personal collection while over here, so that you can test in the shop and at least know that you have purchased a runner before they head out West with you...
Mike Parkes wrote:Mr Youtube sensations knowledge is sparse at the best of times...
Indeed, but I do hope the manufacturers are watching, because he must be representative of a significant number of their actual and potential customers.

The RTR OO product either needs to stand up to this treatment; or to be clearly described on the box and in the product marketing as 'not suitable for Sam'. There have been some threads on this site where it is clear that customers have bought models unaware that they are inevitably rather more 'delicate' or 'difficult' than the general run: and there's nothing to be done about this if such a model is to be produced, because the compromises in the model that derive from the prototype have to be accepted...
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Chops
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Chops »

Well, she finally arrived, and it is splendid. Haven't fired her up yet, but it looks quite promising. Also of note is an unusually solid guarantee by Dapol, which I hope will be of no particular use, but it is the best I've seen yet. I'm too fatigued to put power to her, but perhaps tomorrow. Can anyone possibly give an explanation of the valences? Certainly gives it a most pleasing Art Deco appearance, but it would not seem possible they could do anything to increase speed or economy. Perhaps to shield passengers from falling under the wheels if standing too close to platform's edge? (Someone like me craning to get a better look).

If this beautiful model runs as good as she looks, it certainly won't be my last Dapol purchase.
IMG_20210307_213311.jpg
IMG_20210307_213304.jpg
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Ironduke
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Ironduke »

Magnificent! Have you run out of kidneys yet?
Chops wrote:Can anyone possibly give an explanation of the valences?
in this picture https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... Aug_17.jpg it almost looks like a radiator.
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Rob
Bigmet
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Bigmet »

Chops wrote:Well, she finally arrived, and it is splendidl...
If it runs as sweetly as the sole Dapol product I own (class 21) there will be nothing to complain of.
Chops wrote:... Also of note is an unusually solid guarantee by Dapol...
Never even looked at that since there was no need for it. (Ran the model to a total of 10 hours immediately following arrival, and faultless ever since, now closing in on 15 months in regular use.) But now I have read it, I see that only model locomotives with the 'W' mark are covered. Well, I have now been all over it, including body off, making a close inspection and no 'W' mark. Unless that's the 'WWW.Dapol.co.uk' on the underside of the fuel tank moulding? Surely not, then I am sure they would refer to a 'WWW' mark...

Mystery or what? But of little moment since it is now out of warranty anyway. And running just as sweetly as it looks, did I mention that already?
Chops wrote:...Can anyone possibly give an explanation of the valences? Certainly gives it a most pleasing Art Deco appearance, but it would not seem possible they could do anything to increase speed or economy. Perhaps to shield passengers from falling under the wheels if standing too close to platform's edge? (Someone like me craning to get a better look).
Valances even (valence is a concept in chemistry). Now I may be wrong on this, but I believe the GWR had many 'halts' out in the country areas of their operation which were much like the continental European and North American pattern of 'passenger platform' provision, not much higher than rail level. A protective valance to prevent wayward boys blundering into the working gubbins a good plan in that situation.
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Bufferstop
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Bufferstop »

You are right about it looking like a radiator, It's the air intake for the engine on that side. Providing the valances to cover the mechanicals was essential if the public was to be allowed within touching distance, the cardan shafts which linked engine, gearbox and bogie were in a line along each side just behind the valance. Unlike the 1950's first generation DMU's which were based on this layout the drive did not go to a gear on the centre of the axle but drove onto the end of the axle protruding through the bearings in the axlebox, a real finger trapping arrangement if there was ever one. In many photographs you will see them standing (or even running) with the valance panels hinged upwards and tied up to allow a better flow of air to cool the engine.
The BR first generation diesels didn't have valances and the engines were mounted such that the drive shafts were closer to the centre line of the chassis. Even the last series of DMUs produced before privatisation took the no valances route, using the bodies designed for the Electrostars minus the below floor panelling to make the diesel engines more accessible.
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Chops
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Chops »

So valences were for saving the necks of lads like me. Very good. Breaking it in now, and it is is performing flawlessly through all speed ranges.
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Bufferstop
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Re: Dapol #12 Streamlined Rail Coach: advice please

Post by Bufferstop »

Reading up about the introduction of these railcars I discovered that one of their early successes was a Birmingham to Cardiff service which got into Cardiff early enough for a day in the office and returned in the early evening. A couple of them had a reduced sized guards/luggage compartment and a mini-buffet installed especially for this service. What raised my interest was that it would have passed through our village, long before I lived here, unfortunately there are no residents older than me who were here to have observed it, but there are some photos of them in the local archives office, along with photos of an experimental road/rail bus which left the tracks in the station goods yard and continued on to a local hotel.
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