Point control

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js1975
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Point control

Postby js1975 » Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:43 am

Am bamboozled by how to construct a mimic panel for my point work. I have Peco electrofrog points code 75. Isolated frog etc and the frog currently wired to a switch reversing the polarity. All works fine on my rather small test track. What I want to do is rewire so I can push/throw a switch & have an LED change on a mimic panel AND control a coloured light signal on the layout... Hmmm.

http://www.heathcote-electronics.co.uk/index.htm

Heathcote seem to do some bits that may help me & I also found a load of stuff on relays here:

http://modelrailmusings.weebly.com/
http://s374444733.websitehome.co.uk/c-points/index.htm

Its all great but am lacking a step by step buy this, solder that method. So I might just go down this road:

http://www.traintronics.co.uk/products/ ... ogue/10-57

Could get quite expensive though!! Any thoughts fellow posters?

Happy etc.

mahoganydog
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Re: Point control

Postby mahoganydog » Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:37 pm

Hi JS,

I've not bought one of these but perhaps this might help you? I was eyeing it up for my layout (if I ever get stated on it that is).

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BLOCKsignalli ... 179wt_1128

Jim
In a world of fences and doors who needs windows and gates?

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js1975
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Re: Point control

Postby js1975 » Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:37 pm

I have discovered Cobalt and all their switches & LEDs are nicely pre wired. This maybe the way forward!

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js1975
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Re: Point control

Postby js1975 » Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:39 pm

mahoganydog wrote:Hi JS,

I've not bought one of these but perhaps this might help you? I was eyeing it up for my layout (if I ever get stated on it that is).

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BLOCKsignalli ... 179wt_1128

Jim


Hmmm interesting - http://www.blocksignalling.co.uk/

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Flashbang
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Re: Point control

Postby Flashbang » Mon Dec 29, 2014 5:23 pm

Hi
The first question has to be .... What sort of point motors do you want? Solinoid like Peco PL10 or PL11, Seep PM range or Hornby etc, or use slow motion stall motors like the Tortoise or Cobalt, or then there's the option to use Servo motors.

Once that decision has been made then you can progress with how you control the panel LED indications and how the signalling is controlled.

I personally would opt for using slow motion stall motors which normally have two seperate change over sets of contacts internally fitted. The indications can be by the LEDs wired into one of the two feed wires. Switches are of the locking toggle switch type and the switches toggle lever also shows a positive point position too.
[Image << Click the Icon to go to my website
Broken? It was working correctly when I left it.

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js1975
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Re: Point control

Postby js1975 » Tue Dec 30, 2014 10:18 am

Hey Flashbang. Have been consuming a lot of written material & I think the Cobalt route is the path I am going to go down. Will probably order a couple to fiddle & play with. Along with a PSU of some sorts. Am in no rush to start building so will take my time in choosing everything. I like the idea with the posher Cobalts that you can use either DC or DCC. Again after more reading it appears that many users prefer to drive their stock with DCC and operate points with DC. I guess when investing a hundred quid or so in point motors you want to have as much future proofing as possible!

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Flashbang
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Re: Point control

Postby Flashbang » Tue Dec 30, 2014 10:35 am

Hi
The analogue Cobalt point motor is IMO a good choice.
Its best I have found if driven from a 9 volt regulated dc power supply unit. A low milliamp output 9volt power supply would be fine or any offering a dc regulated output. Example... eBay link to regulated PSU
Any of the analogue Cobalt motor range can of course be converted to DCC operation by using the DCC Concepts decoder which clips onto the point motors casing.
If you're able to buy 12 Cobalts at once, Hattons sell 12 pack at £135 which is just £11.25 per motor. This is about the cheapest point motor with double pole switching incorporated available. Hattons link then scroll to the bottom of the page.
[Image << Click the Icon to go to my website
Broken? It was working correctly when I left it.

HansP
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Re: Point control

Postby HansP » Tue Jan 13, 2015 11:17 am

I would definitely recommend Cobalt - especially their newer motors with three changeover contacts, even quieter mechanism and all pre-setup from the factory with wire, fulcrum etc.. all pre-assembled and centered in the middle position (no need to do any more before installing).

There are all sorts of ways to control these - my preference is for six-core alarm cable with the cores wired thus:

Motor Control
Use two cores of the alarm cable and solder them to the two motor inputs. Back at the control panel, wire a DPDT toggle switch as a changeover switch i.e. common poles connected to the motor and +/- wired to the four inputs. Cobalt do a diagram of this in with their instructions - takes longer to type this description than to actually do it. Feed the DPDT switch with 9 - 12V DC and, upon toggling the DPDT switch your motor should throw the turnout. No need for any cut-off at the end-of-throw as the motor is designed to be always on and draws about 15mA in this state (about the same as an LED).

Another way of doing this is to replace the DPDT switch with a bistable relay, wired up in just the same way as the toggle switch. Then, use two momentary push-buttons wired one each to the "set" and "reset" cores of the relay. This facilitates push-button control of the point, which opens up other options for route-setting using diode matrices in place of the buttons, but that's another story / OT.

Frog Switchover
Do this locally - wire the common pole of the motor's first changeover switch to the frog, and wire the two inputs to each rail (one +, one -). Check you've done this the right way round; if it shorts, simply swap the wires over.

LED Control
Wire one core of the alarm cable to the common pole of the motor's second change-over switch, and wire two further cores to the outputs. Feed the wire connected to the common pole with +12V DC back at the panel, and wire two 12V LED (the kind with resistors pre-wired) to the ends of the two cores (one LED for each core) that you connected to the outputs. Check these are the right way round before applying 12V, as the maximum safe reverse voltage can be lower (i.e. 5V) which would blow the LED.

Hope the above helps, although I appreciate someone else's (wordy) description can be hard to follow. Happy to sketch a wiring diagram for you if it helps.

Regards,

HansP.

Edit - P.S. here's a diagram explaining how to wire a dpdt switch (or relay) to reverse polarity -> http://rollertrol.com/DC-motor-reverse-switch-diagram
Last edited by HansP on Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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js1975
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Re: Point control

Postby js1975 » Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:54 pm

HansP - I will read your post in a quiet dark room & digest. Thanks!


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