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Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 3:33 pm
by dougalmac2
Hi all

I am contemplating using a number of Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses kits along the front of my layout. I have gone as far as downloading the files but am having a problem working out the size of the overall floorplan. One of the images on the Scalescenes page gives the overall size of a pair of houses as 140mm wide by 188mm deep but this doesn't seem to tie in with the printed floorplan.

Has anyone on here built these and, if so, can they comment on these measurements please?

I'm thinking of building six or seven of these but the cost of ink or getting them printed is getting a bit worrying.

I would very much appreciate it if anyone has access to the actual sizes.


Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 3:45 pm
by Bufferstop
Why don't you print out a draft(lower quality or fast) copy of one and build it in paper just to get the dimensions.
I've used Scalescenes, and other downloads, five foot of retaining wall for starters, and not found the ink use to be prohibitive.

Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 4:00 pm
by dougalmac2
Hi Bufferstop

Thanks for the immediate response, I thought of doing a rough build but without using proper card thicknesses on the walls its not that accurate.

The kit uses between 13 and 16 sheets of A4, I had previously printed about six sheets of brickpaper from a new cartridge and run out after about 20 sheets, For 6 or 7 kits that's building up. I got a quote from a local print shop and they wanted £43 for 7 sets.

I know in the grand scheme of things that's not going to break the bank but with all the cost of card etc. it soon mounts up. Don't get me wrong, I'll probably do it in the end.


Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 4:25 pm
by Tom@Crewe
When your ink ran out after only 20 sheets was it a new printer? Some times cartridrge's included with a new printer only have 10% fill.
Also cheaper printers with the 3 inks in one cartridge don't hold much ink at all and need renewing even if 2 colours are are 50% full but one other low.

Also try e-bay! a genuine set for mine from e-bay was £21, PcWorld wanted £34.

Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:38 pm
by dougalmac2
Thanks for that Tom

It's not a new printer but it is one where the three colours are in one small cartridge and they never seem to last long.
I must be honest I've never bought them online but I might try now.


Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 12:08 am
by Bigglesof266
dougalmac2 wrote:I'm thinking of building six or seven of these but the cost of ink or getting them printed is getting a bit worrying. Mac

Can't help you with the sizes of that kit, but have built many Scalescenes kits and so can offer some general advice re your ink and general cost concerns.

First comment is a matter of individual acceptability as to the finished result, namely the print quality including inks used. Caveat: Your standard of what you consider acceptable may vary - higher or lower.

For ink steadfastness to resist fading one in situ over time on the layout or staining during build, IMV it is absolutely necessary to use a colour fixative spray. On Scalescenes, Metcalfe or Superquick, I do this before to each printed sheet commencing a build, Scalescenes notable after attaching the printed paper to its backing board with 3M spray adhesive , 3M or one of similar quality.

Second. Print quality. I've used laser printers plus Epson Photo Stylus 6 colour, and 4 colour printers for many years. Best colour results are achieved with either laser on quality coated laser paper or 6 colour quality inks in photo quality on their photo printing quality white paper (not the card).

Inks. Many Epson printer retail cartridge inks are pigment ink. These are duller than dye, so the best result is achieved using their recommended special white paper which returns a superb saturation, contrast and colour trueness result. If using generic $5 GP reams the result will be underwhelming. Subtle contrast is especially important when printing repetative brickwork in dark colours IMO. This is why Metcalfe chose light bright red coloured brickwork to market their early kits IMO, and still prefer lighter brick or stone colours to present well.

Other printers, e.g. Canon and including 4 colour Epson business inkjets use dye ink cartridges. I have one of those too ATM. Fantastic for everyday printing, copying, faxing etc., but not as good for this particular purpose.

Inks. You can buy some outstanding quality dye inks in 2017. But you won't find these in pound store generic cartridges. More on this in a moment. The result from 4 colour printers using dye inks intended as a GP home printer is even more highly dependent on paper and ink quality. Although not as good as the first two options, the results from these still can be of quite a good enough standard to be acceptable to me if the paper and ink quality guidelines previously mentioned are adhered to.

How to achieve this affordably?

Cartridge cost. Don't use them unless you do small volume infrequent printing. One word, or acronym really. CIS. Continuous Ink System. Manufacturers decry them for one reason, and don't offer their own for the same reason. Profit. I've been using CIS reliably in my successive inkjets in excess of a decade, and Epsons with their ultra fine printheads in the printer are the finickiest printers of all IME.

Buy a CIS for your printer. Do buy a qualty one from an established reputable supplier and choose to have them fill it with quality ink usually offered by said reputable supplier. Good quality dye inks give a superb printed finish, especially so if used in conjunction with quality paper on a decent printer. If a fixative is used post printing as elaborated in a previous paragraph, their colour fastness will outlast both you and me. Do avoid the inclination to buy a CIS cheap from eBay. Cheap units don't function as well, the print result looks beyond dreadful, and cheap invariably means absolute rubbish Chinese inks which will inevitibly dry in the head blocking your print head rendering your printer useless.

Once you have a CIS, you'll never worry about the cost or quality of ink (expensive OEM or alternative reputable ink filled brand proprietary chipped cartridges) again.

Unfortunately, to achieve the kind of printed result I expect those are the prerequisites.

As to your addressing your primary concern re cost, a CIS is the way to contain the major consumable cost for volume printing using inkjet printers. It'll pay for itself with a project such as the one you have in mind, and take away any concerns you have with Scalescenes in the future.

Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:04 am
by Bufferstop
Hi Mac, I won't suggest getting a new printer, others already have. You should be able to identify the sheets within the PDF which generate the shape of the building, don't forget the instruction file, shows what to join to what, which should be a help at arriving at the main dimensions then if necessary print out just one or two sheets. If your PDF reader won't allow you to do that, try another reader there's dozens of them on line, free, and Adobe's own isn't the best in terms of flexibility. The other bit of advice, if your PDF reader has its own print dialogue it should have a link to "use the system print dialogue", which often has options that the reader doesn't offer, like "current page" or "selection".
A PDF reader is just a tool and just like your modelling tool kit it pays to have several tools for the same task which each offer something a bit different.
On the subject of printers I have a Canon A3 Pixma, no bells or whistles like auto duplex but it does guide you through the job. It has five ink tanks three for colours plus a matching black and a double size dye based black. The tanks fit into a replaceable carrier which has the print heads in it, so I'm not paying for the print head every time I change the ink, it's probably about time for me to change the carrier, there's a wizard that guides you through the alignment process. (Print a special page. Pick the pattern that matches do it again to check)

Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:36 pm
by dougalmac2
Hi Bigglesof266 and Bufferstop

Thanks for all that info.

My printer is a HP Deskjet D1600 which uses a small single colour cartridge. I normally do very little colour printing and in the past I've felt it probably dried up before I'd used it fully. Its OK for small jobs and where I've built a single building but is obviously not up to this job. So on the strength of this I'm leaning towards having the whole lot printed commercially.

With the PDF reader I have I can select individual pages for testing so I may do some of that first.

I'm not in a rush for this so will give it more consideration.

Again thanks a lot for taking time to help.


Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:07 pm
by Bufferstop
Just one little comment, my wife has a portable printer that she takes to her meetings it has combined colour, and a black cartridges. There was a mistake in the handouts that had been printed in advance, so her little printer got hammered and the colour ran out. The local Staples didn't have the cartridges for it. They offered to do the job, but it included questions from a forthcoming exam, so that was out, they were a bit embarrassed as they were selling that printer. Eventually after a load of head scratching they sold her an Epson which was already on special offer at an extra 20% off, which made it cheaper than a set of cartridges for her printer. She put the printer down as consumables on her exes and as we needed another printer like a hole in the head, she donated it to the receptionist at the hotel who always looks after her.
I bet you could find a printer for less than they would want for full colour printing a row of houses.

Re: Scalescenes T022 Terraced Houses

Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 8:25 pm
by dougalmac2
Hi Bufferstop

I probably could buy a printer cheaper than a full set of colour ink, but often, printers are sold with a reduced quantity of ink included so I could end up back where I started.

I've decided to go with buying extra capacity ink cartridges on the net. The sellers reckon they should give more than 200 colour pages for about the same as I pay locally for the standard fill, and a lot less than I was quoted to have it printed.

I'll keep you informed on how this works out.

Now to find the best compromise on paper quality and cost. Watch this space.

Thanks to all who've followed this and contributed.