2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Have any questions or tips and advice on how to build those bits that don't come ready made.
nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:10 pm

Hello all and Merry Christmas, Seasons Greetings, Happy Hannukah etc

Some of you may recall in the long distant past that I was planning to bash out a couple of RTR items to recreate prototype vehicles that could at one time be seen on the Alexander Railroad in North Carolina. Needless to say, (this is me after all,) other distractions came along and I never progressed very far, my main self reasoning was that I wanted to find/print decals before I actually needed them, halting progress. Well, progress was halted before I even finished stripping them down, so now this competition gives me a boost and reason to crack on.

I still have the decal issue and to that end I am going to ask for assistance now to help track down the likely needed objects, or if anyone is feeling generous with their time and has access to a printer, I'd happily pay a tenner including postage for the items to be produced for me. I did see the printed infommercial in the latest BRM, but I figure their wait times may extend to beyond February, especially with the increased exposure they'll have gotten.

Anyway, on to the projects. First off is the transformation of a Rivarossi Heavyweight Pullman,

Image

into Alexandria, seen here.

Second off, is the easier flatcar from a True Line model, (seen on the right,)

Image

into ARC 02, seen here.

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:18 am

I am sure many of us have a printer and would be willing to help, but we need a bit more info first! What are the decals you need?
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:39 am

A very good question :D
Off the top of my head, it's the ARC 100 texts along with Alexandria and Alexander for the coach, along with Alexander in the same typeface for the wagon, albeit slightly smaller, along with ARC 02 MW. I think the weight designations on 02 may be a bit too small for a home printer to reproduce clearly, so I am going to skip those, I dare say the majority of people wouldn't notice it unless pointed out to them and I can always try and source a decal pack at a later date for that.

If someone was willing to help, I guess it would make sense to Have Alexander also printed out at the same time for my 2 locos in order to not waste decal paper

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:02 pm

I must be missing something?
I can envisage a home printer using paper and I guess you can by clear transparent sheets for OHP, but how can a print be applied to a carriage?
Can you buy special clear sheets, print in reverse, than apply by rubbing down like 'Letraset"? Or can you buy a backing paper and reverse print, that can then be used as a wet transfer?
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:25 pm

This link will probably explain it much better than I could, but basically it's a film that you can put into a home printer to create your own custom decals.
https://www.craftycomputerpaper.co.uk/decal-paper-c553

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:52 pm

Ok, then you can make your own waterslides! Cool!

Next, the text height needs to be known, so it can be printed to the scale required
Ideally we need to know the Font type, but as it is quite simple, I guess one close enough can be found!
Last, someone needs to be found with the best DPI printer!
They are usually 600DPI x 600DPI, but in some there is a high quality mode that gives 600DPI x 1320DPI,etc,etc
Others have even better resolution, my HP7500 supposedly is "Color print resolution: Up to 4800 x 1200 dpi optimized on HP Premium Plus photo papers with 1200 x 1200 input dpi", but knowing how to set it up, to get that resolution is only for the PC guru! :shock:

600 x 600 is usually sharp on paper, but for such small print it may show up as "blocky"
If someone tells me the height of "ARC 100", I can have a go on paper and see what DPI is acceptable
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:25 pm

I had a measure up of the coach and I'd say that 1.8mm is about the right height. As for text though, I thought it would be a lot simpler than it is, (just fire up Open Office and have a scroll through). As it turns out, it looks like "Myanmar Text" or "Verdana" are closest, both in Bold setting. Maybe someone else has some suggestions on the font used?

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:52 pm

A quick print out from word gives
4 point = 1mm
6 point = 1.5mm
The printer is not at 4800DPI, unless you specify weird HP paper, it wont accept the setting!
At "Best" setting on plain paper, I assume its at 600DPI, gives printed text under the spy glass, that I cant see any blockyness
So I think this is very dooable with a simple 600DPI printer!
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:00 pm

TimberSurf wrote:I must be missing something?
I can envisage a home printer using paper and I guess you can by clear transparent sheets for OHP, but how can a print be applied to a carriage?
Can you buy special clear sheets, print in reverse, than apply by rubbing down like 'Letraset"? Or can you buy a backing paper and reverse print, that can then be used as a wet transfer?

:!: Gee Wiz :!: I am dumb!

I discovered this 3-4 years ago and was so impressed, I published a link on my website! It's even the same supplier!

http://www.elotion.co.uk/links.html

Loosing brain cells by the day!
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:10 am

Nah, it just means that although you saw the potential of it at the time, you haven't found a use for it personally.

Thank you for carrying out those tests for me, it's great to know that it is at least possible with a regular printer, I'm guessing that 7 point should be about right sizing wise. The larger writing I am guessing to be around 3.2mm high, so 13 point if my math and scaling is right?

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:54 am

When I finally get a layout running, one of the many projects on a back burner, is to light all my carriages, as part of the upgrade, I will need to change carriage numbers so they are not the same and the restaurant and buffet ones will need re lettering, as all my stock is very second hand and worn. Crafty paper is ideal (print whatever I like), so is of interest to me. If no one else volunteers, I might be persuaded to be your nominated printer!
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

User avatar
Dad-1
Posts: 4695
Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:05 pm
Location: Dorset - A mile from West Bay.

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby Dad-1 » Sat Jan 07, 2017 12:40 pm

I've not studied all the postings so may cover someone's reply.

Self-print decal paper is fine and can be successful BUT inkjet printers can't print
white. They also rely on the white paper to enhance any colour printing, just
printing on clear decal paper the actual colour density is too low to be seen clearly.
You can get away with black text as ink deposits are heavier.
For any colour work to be good it needs to be on white decal paper, but in most
model requirements you can't have white backgrounds.

I assume laser printing has the same restrictions.

The only and perhaps no longer available, was the Alps wax type printer, used to be
expensive and I don't know about the cost/availability of the pigments used. With them
you could print white, gold, silver, but I never saw it as a worthwhile investment.

Geoff T.
Remember ... I know nothing about railways.
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=32187 and Another on viewtopic.php?f=22&t=28436&start=60&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

User avatar
TimberSurf
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:47 pm
Location: N.Wales
Contact:

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby TimberSurf » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:41 pm

I guess someone has to buy the paper and try!
Here are some more experiments, top alexander's are with a space between each letter

Alexandra Fonts.jpg
Alexandra Fonts.jpg (22.54 KiB) Viewed 218 times
Image
Lumsdonia <--- Hit link to go to my website for full story and wiring advice!

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:00 pm

Dad-1 wrote:I've not studied all the postings so may cover someone's reply.

Self-print decal paper is fine and can be successful BUT inkjet printers can't print
white. They also rely on the white paper to enhance any colour printing, just
printing on clear decal paper the actual colour density is too low to be seen clearly.
You can get away with black text as ink deposits are heavier.
For any colour work to be good it needs to be on white decal paper, but in most
model requirements you can't have white backgrounds.

I assume laser printing has the same restrictions.

The only and perhaps no longer available, was the Alps wax type printer, used to be
expensive and I don't know about the cost/availability of the pigments used. With them
you could print white, gold, silver, but I never saw it as a worthwhile investment.

Geoff T.



Thanks for that Geoff, as much info and experience as possible is needed before deciding the best course of action. If only I could track down commercial decals of the right size, but all I see is random codes and little to no descriptions in most cases of what the sheet contains.

nickbrad
Posts: 761
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:53 am
Location: Lincoln, UK

Re: 2017 Competition: Bashing RTR stock for Gantsville

Postby nickbrad » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:04 pm

TimberSurf wrote:I guess someone has to buy the paper and try!
Here are some more experiments, top alexander's are with a space between each letter

Alexandra Fonts.jpg


Corbel 8 point looks right, as does the AIGDT bold font.


Return to “Scratch and Kit building”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests