Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Discuss Dapol Model Railway products and related model railway topics here.
User avatar
D605Eagle
Posts: 2592
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:58 am
Location: Staffordshire
Contact:

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby D605Eagle » Wed Nov 01, 2017 7:33 pm

That looks beautiful, but I fear this hobby is getting far too expensive for me!

User avatar
Mountain
Posts: 5386
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:43 pm
Location: Somewhere in Wales, UK.

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Mountain » Wed Nov 01, 2017 11:25 pm

A few of them were scrapped after catching fire.
The two car versions were sometimes run as three cars via adding a GWR coach in the centre.
Some were geared for 60 mph running and others were geared for 40 so they could tow more weight like aa few wagons or an extra coach.
I believe the designs had no engine idling speed so if the engine speed dropped it would cut out.

User avatar
Bufferstop
Posts: 13484
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:06 pm
Location: Bottom end of N. Warks line

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Bufferstop » Wed Nov 01, 2017 11:42 pm

Emettman wrote:Looking very nice...
Just asking: what does it have as a minimum radius tolerance (for hidden curves only, of course!)

Questions like that mean I'm going to have to read the info sheet from end to end to see if it's mentioned. It's certainly not phased by my 18" corners and that wide body does mean more space behind those skirts, it's the clearance needed inside the curves to accommodate the body overhang that you need to consider.

Re you question if they ever worked in multiple, I don't think there was any provision to couple the single units together or even two sets of twins. The only time I saw one of the twins it was running with the extra coach in the centre. It was late on in the lives of these units and they had survived just long enough to get a coat of multiple unit green, the coach in the middle still being in all over maroon. I've been told that on certain occasions when the long cable could not be found a single unit managed to pull the extra coach and it's other half.
Growing old, can't avoid it. Growing up, forget it!
My Layout, My Workbench Blog and My Opinions

Bigmet
Posts: 9117
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:19 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Bigmet » Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:40 am

Bufferstop wrote:...Re you question if they ever worked in multiple, I don't think there was any provision to couple the single units together...

The lack of bufferheads must make this impossible to do safely. Even if they aligned well enough when stationary, movement between two of the railmotors while underway would see the shafts slip past each other, with consequent loss of buffering action.

Bigmet
Posts: 9117
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:19 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Bigmet » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:12 pm

Mountain wrote:...It is interesting what used to run on our lines years ago. Kidwelly brickworks was said to have the largest wagons on the GWR system and possibly in the UK at the time...

Unlikely as far as the UK is concerned, never heard of them before. Unlike the GNR's famous bogie brick wagons for the enormous traffic in Flettons from the Peterborough area brickworks, which were well known to the extent of having models in both the Hornby Dublo and Triang ranges. Those weren't the largest pregroup wagons by any stretch, the GCR and NER had very large trolleys and other specially constructed vehicles for movement of castings and forgings from the heavy industry sites they served.

User avatar
Lysander
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:53 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Lysander » Thu Nov 02, 2017 3:13 pm

Surely the largest GWR wagons were the 40ton bogie brick wagons?

Tony
Men with false teeth may yet speak the truth.......

User avatar
Bufferstop
Posts: 13484
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:06 pm
Location: Bottom end of N. Warks line

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Bufferstop » Thu Nov 02, 2017 3:53 pm

Bigmet wrote:The lack of bufferheads must make this impossible to do safely. Even if they aligned well enough when stationary, movement between two of the railmotors while underway would see the shafts slip past each other, with consequent loss of buffering action.

Buffer heads were fitted from no.18 onward, I've only found one photo of two of the later "semi-streamlined" units running coupled together, the text does not indicate whether both were powered, both driven, or one running as a trailer.
Numbers 1 to 17 were of the early fully streamlined design, and had only buffer shanks protruding, no.18 was fitted with buffer heads, had the lower panels reshaped to expose the bogies, and was equipped with electro-pneumatic control to allow it to be driven from a dedicated trailer. No's 35/36 and 37/38 were built as 2 car sets, no's 36 and 38 being equipped as buffet cars. No.37 was destroyed by fire in 1947 and no.33 was modified to take its place. The two car sets were lengthened from time to time by the insertion of a 70ft ten compartment coach. I haven't found any reference to what we would now understand as multiple unit working, but the control systems employed from no.18 onward would have required minimal alteration to enable it.
Growing old, can't avoid it. Growing up, forget it!
My Layout, My Workbench Blog and My Opinions

User avatar
Mountain
Posts: 5386
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:43 pm
Location: Somewhere in Wales, UK.

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Mountain » Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:32 pm

Lysander wrote:Surely the largest GWR wagons were the 40ton bogie brick wagons?

Tony

These were not GWR wagons. They were privately owned and made large just to cross the GWR main line which used to charge per wagon. Hence they built the largest wagons they could get away with. The line was only a couple of miles long and was fed from Mynydd Y Garreg mountain via a narrow gauge line. The clay there was in high demand for brick making as the bricks could withstand very high temperatures for industrial use. When I was show these bricks they had a lovely shiny glazed appearance. Was a silica brick works? Very good quality clay is also found on the next mountain across being Pembrey Mountain. Also below the clay is a good grade of anthracite, so in various parts of this area are riddled with mine tunnels. Early mines were cell mines, though there was a Roman mine used to extract Silica, though later rebuilt for coal use.
Going back to the diesel railcars, I get confused when people use the term "First Generation DMU's and then refer to a class 101 or 108 etc, as to me they are second generation DMU's, and it is the likes of the GWR and LMS examples which were the true first generation. They were not the first technically, but they were the first main " Push" at the universal concept of diesel railcar traction.
As far as I am aware, all the GWR examples were designed for passengers to board them at ground level or platform level. This was due to the many halts which had no actual raised platforms along the routes the railcars were designed for. They didnt have to be fast (Even though they looked well streamlined). They did need to be economical. This was the main reason why they were made in a streamlined way.
The LMS had some interesting designs. A bus that drove onto the track and off again at the end of the line. Though on the road they were slow and heavy (Mind you, what bus wasn't slow in those days!), the concept was a very forward one which also eliminated the need for them to be fitted with duplicate cabs as all they needed was a buffer less siding and they could turn them around a full 180°.

User avatar
Mountain
Posts: 5386
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:43 pm
Location: Somewhere in Wales, UK.

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Mountain » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:00 pm

Bigmet wrote:
Mountain wrote:...It is interesting what used to run on our lines years ago. Kidwelly brickworks was said to have the largest wagons on the GWR system and possibly in the UK at the time...

Unlikely as far as the UK is concerned, never heard of them before. Unlike the GNR's famous bogie brick wagons for the enormous traffic in Flettons from the Peterborough area brickworks, which were well known to the extent of having models in both the Hornby Dublo and Triang ranges. Those weren't the largest pregroup wagons by any stretch, the GCR and NER had very large trolleys and other specially constructed vehicles for movement of castings and forgings from the heavy industry sites they served.

I know they were bogie wagons. I dont know a lot else except they were used in the early days and made to the largest size they could so they were not charged so much to cross the GWR main line at Kidwelly. Not sure how long the wagons lasted as in a way they were inconvenient, slo when the GWR changed its charging policy it would not really be worth keeping them. They were used for a short line in between a narrow gauge feeder from the clay quarry on a nearby hill, to the silica brick works on the seaward bit of land which used to have a dock etc in earlier years along with a canal syste!m.

User avatar
Lysander
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:53 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Lysander » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:57 pm

Mountain wrote:
Lysander wrote:Surely the largest GWR wagons were the 40ton bogie brick wagons?

Tony

These were not GWR wagons. They were privately owned and made large just to cross the GWR main line which used to charge per wagon. .


OOOps - my mistake - I meant bogie coal wagons, not bogie brick wagons.

Tony
Men with false teeth may yet speak the truth.......

User avatar
Mountain
Posts: 5386
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:43 pm
Location: Somewhere in Wales, UK.

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Mountain » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:40 pm

Lysander wrote:
Mountain wrote:
Lysander wrote:Surely the largest GWR wagons were the 40ton bogie brick wagons?

Tony

These were not GWR wagons. They were privately owned and made large just to cross the GWR main line which used to charge per wagon. .


OOOps - my mistake - I meant bogie coal wagons, not bogie brick wagons.

Tony

These were for clay and/or silica I believe as they made silica bricks with a glazed effect which were made to withstand high temperatures. Not sure, but they may have been made somewhere between the 1860's and 1900 though I can't find any info. on them on the internet. I read about them in a book but I dont thing the book was written for the specific railway company. Is annoying as there are lots of books I've remembered various bits of info. from...

User avatar
Lysander
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:53 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Lysander » Sat Nov 04, 2017 5:05 pm

To get back on topic, this really is a very pretty model, inspite of the slightly sparse interior.

Image

I'll post a link to a full review in a day or two.

Tony
Men with false teeth may yet speak the truth.......

User avatar
Mountain
Posts: 5386
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:43 pm
Location: Somewhere in Wales, UK.

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Mountain » Sat Nov 04, 2017 6:07 pm

It looks really nice except it may need toning down a little. Looks like fresh paint.

User avatar
Bufferstop
Posts: 13484
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:06 pm
Location: Bottom end of N. Warks line

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Bufferstop » Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:23 pm

My impression is that the yellow/cream shows up more strongly in photos than it does for real. Unfortunately almost wall of the prototype pictures I can find are monochrome so it's difficult to judge the extent of the surface dirt that they collected, and running with the covers off didn't help much either. By the time we entered BR's filth period most of them had received MU green and been shifted out to the branch lines where they didn't get so dirty.
Not only have Dapol got the gearing right for a beleiveable top speed but the directional lights are as I remember them, (they were the same as those on the BR first den units) that's about as bright as an oil lamp but without the flicker, almost invisible by day, the driving cab light is about right too.
I wonder if this will prompt Hornby to dust off the tools for the ex Lima semi streamlined design and fit it with an up to date drive.
Growing old, can't avoid it. Growing up, forget it!
My Layout, My Workbench Blog and My Opinions

User avatar
Lysander
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:53 pm

Re: Dapol GWR DMU railmotor

Postby Lysander » Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:29 pm

....and proper flush widows too!

Tony
Men with false teeth may yet speak the truth.......


Return to “Dapol”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest