Dapol Class 22

[carnehan]

Hi, I am in the market for a new Diesel engine and one of my preferred choices would be a class 22 or 29. My layout is DCC and I believe Hornbys 29 would just be too much of a hassle to convert to DCC with any great success.

My question is this, is the Dapol Class 22 a good model? I.e. Is it a good runner, does it look good up close, what is the detailing like and above all is it worth paying well over £120 for a DCC ready version?

Incidentally my other desirable option at the minute is the Class 23 Baby Deltic by Heljan.

Thanks in advance for any help folks.

Paul

[Bigmet]

I've seen the Dapol class 22 a couple of times and it looks good, ran very well on an exhibition layout. Like any model some people have found faults and problems, but the general reception has been positive. And in OO RTR there's a big choice of just one model if a class 22 is what you want!

Heljan's class 23; just recently got one of the new disc headcode versions (original condition of the class) after what felt like quite a long wait since the later headcode box rebuilds were first released. Looks right, measures up pretty well, running some of the best I have seen from any RTR centre motor diesel model. The LED lighting is a step up from the bulbs found in many earlier Heljan models. Pleased with it in short. Probably worth mentioning that the copious bufferbeam detail may need to be removed at least in part, to suit whatever coupler you choose to fit, simply so that the detail will not foul the coupler.

Both these models way ahead of the Hornby class 29 which is from a previous generation of models. I have the body from one of these modified to as close as possible to class 21 condition, and mounted on a Bachmann chassis for better running. Dapol have promised a class 21 and 29 (sensibly enough as the cab shape is exactly as the class 22) and if they - or any other maker - can produce something akin to the Dapol class 22 for looks, I shall replace my modified effort, pronto!

[carnehan]

Thanks for the detailed reply Bigmet. It's been very useful..

[SRman]

I don't have a class 23 but most of the Heljan mechs are a little way ahead of the best of the others for both smoothness and quietness, IMHO ... and that's saying something, good as the newer Hornby and Bachmann mechs are! Hornby's class 50 and 60 mechanisms would run a very close second though.

The Dapol 22 is also an excellent runner and as powerful as you would ever need for an 1100 hp diesel. The mech is a little noisier than the Heljan/Hornby or even Bachmann models but just as smooth as any of them. I also had an acident with mine (no fault of Dapol's whatsoever) but the backup service from Dapol was second to none, although I have had excellent service from Hornby and Howes (Heljan's agents) as well.

[carnehan]

Thanks SRman. Very helpful. I am torn between the Deltic and 23 now. Would love to take the plunge on both but not sure that would get past SWMBO's nothing to declare channel.

[GWR_fan]

Being Western Region biassed I would like a class 22 and a friendly dealer has a few for a decent price. Alas, all the bad press has me wondering if I should take the plunge. Some report no issues at all and others report all sorts of issues from shorted out wiring/circuit boards, lights that fail within minutes of running plus failed axles and power pickup issues. Along with that one apparently needs to use a specific (recent HM2000) controller if running on analogue as the motor does not like most controllers available. If failures were uncommon then I would ignore the possibility of getting a dud but it seems that the failure rate is uncomfortably high.

Should I get a dud then returning to the authorised repairer in the UK (DCC Supplies?) is not cost effective. I can also get a relatively inexpensive new Dapol class 52 but it also has reliability issues.

I still would like a class 22, but while my recently purchased very old but mint Hornby class 29 is at least reliable (although not a WR based locomotive) I may have to pass on the purchase. A shame as it looks to be a well executed model.

[Bigmet]

I simply don't know the true state of reliability of the Dapol OO centre motor twin bogie models. The reports are so variable, everything from 'all is peachy' to 'it's a complete pile of dog-doo'. The pile of dog-doo reports are at about the same scale as other model makers known product problems over the years - Heljan class 17 (motor burn out/tight gears), Hornby class 30/31 (mazak rot) Bachmann 37 (slipping drive insert in flywheel) - so it's definitely real and significant in my view. They simply haven't made a product that suits my modelling interest so I haven't had a chance to do a hands on tear down and look for the design weaknesses; and the one friend who owns a Dapol LMS 10000 has not run it that much. (What I have seen of it running is fine.)

The Dapol 22's exterior appearance is exquisite, much of this down to the excellent rendering of the fine pillars of the cab glazing. Should they ever produce the class 21, my fall back plan in the event of mechanism problems is to use the Bachmann chassis that currently powers my modified Hornby body, an excellent runner.

[GWR_fan]

Bigmet,
many thanks. Looks like if I want one (or two) then I have to take a risk and hope for the best!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bigmet]

And also: Dapol have listed a batch of NBL DH type 2 / class 22 for production, which I expect will be welcomed by those modelling 'down West' where they operated. Some mention of possible modified cab detail, but what sort of arcana surrounds this I know nothing.

There were unreliability reports on the first batch of these models, quoted summary from up thread here:

... the bad press has me wondering if I should take the plunge. Some report no issues at all and others report all sorts of issues from shorted out wiring/circuit boards, lights that fail within minutes of running plus failed axles and power pickup issues. Along with that one apparently needs to use a specific (recent HM2000) controller if running on analogue as the motor does not like most controllers available. If failures were uncommon then I would ignore the possibility of getting a dud but it seems that the failure rate is uncomfortably high...

Now, the very similar class 21 and 29 has been a shining star in respect of performance (my own and a friend's example) and online there was a deafening silence about problems from owners, usually a sign that all is well. So I would hope that Dapol are all sorted now. The sole grumble I have is that Dapol didn't include an assembly/spares diagram with the class 21/29: but then again I haven't needed one, and the mechanism assembly has proved very straightforward.

And in the 'praiseworthy and deserving of mention' category, is the ease with which the body is removed from the mechanism, yet positively retained in place in use: a benchmark for how it should be done. Very welcome change from the 'major wrestling match' (Heljan, Bachmann) 'often difficult to access or release screws' (Bachmann, Hornby) and 'screw inserts break out of mouldings' (Hornby). I await what Accurascale, Cavalex, Hattons, Kernow, Rails, &c might achieve in this vein, should they produce something that interests me.

[D605Eagle]

Seems that Dapol have blown open the horse radish that Hornby and Bachmann have been dishing out about increasing prices too. These nbl type 2s announced are at a very reasonable cost. At least 4 to be ordered by me!

[Bigmet]

Seems that Dapol have blown open the horse radish that Hornby and Bachmann have been dishing out about increasing prices too. These nbl type 2s announced are at a very reasonable cost...

I'd regard this as a business decision pure and simple. Hornby and Bachmann have well established reputations and demand for their product. That gives them options not available to their competitors. Use the manufacturing slots you have available to make a larger range of models, but in shorter runs that are going to sell out, even at the higher asking prices. Then if gauged correctly the outcomes are offering the potential customers a greater product choice, investing less in manufacturing cost per product due to the smaller volume, speeding up ROI with a fast sell out, and maintaining or improving net profit by charging more.

That's a winning formula if it comes off, in an industry which is all about reinvesting the income from the previous product into more tooling to expand the range and thus keep the customer interested in the brand. Hornby have been explicit about the pressure they feel from so many competing brands entering the market: they are doing something to keep the focus on their brand is my perception. Quite a contrast to their previous somewhat lazy habits in my perception.