Heljan DP2

Discuss Heljan Model Railway products and related model railway topics here.
Bigmet
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Bigmet » Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:03 pm

Quite thankful for this thread as it reminded me to order another Baby Deltic, while Hattons are still knocking them out at £69. We're not going to see prices like this for 'best in class' level OO models much longer...

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Phipps
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Phipps » Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:23 pm

Shame that Heljan dont do an N version at a similar price....

Have a feeling I'll experience similar troubles with my DP2 as I haven't tried it on radius 2 or 3 curves yet. Not averse to trimming a bit of detail off though.

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:22 am

I know that Heljan were blasted for the shape of the DP2 and that several design features were criticised as well as the wide operating radius, but why are they still languishing unsold at that Liverpool dealer?

I bit the bullet and purchased two DP2 models (both liveries) as I have wanted them for awhile. VAT exemption pays for the postage. Hopefully, they will impress, although the derailment issue does concern me.

Bigmet
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Bigmet » Sun Apr 05, 2015 3:17 pm

It's a 'limited operation' prototype, relatively short life from introduction to accident, and confined pretty much to ER only which really puts a limit on likely interest. Last time I looked the Lion and Kestrel prototypes were still hanging around on offer too, and the LMS twins haven't exactly raced away, with many of the versions announced being cancelled - though there of course the duplication has hurt - and the SR prototype diesels have never appeared at all, so possibly the orders didn't come in the necessary quantities.

Specific to DP2 the visible error in body shape was the 'killer' for me, (and I know other ER modellers who share my opinion) and that cannot have helped its prospects. Would have had one like a shot had it been right to complete the set of DP1 and production Deltics; even though DP2 is strictly out of period for my modelling. But it looks plain wrong next to its 'sisters', and with the work involved to get a right one it's better to start from a production Deltic. That would be my choice if I needed a DP2 for realistic operation. Although at - say - £20, I'd bite the bullet. Come on Rails of Hatnow, someone list basement level prices to shift 'em...

Bigmet
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Bigmet » Sun Apr 05, 2015 3:48 pm

My 2009 thoughts on prototype diesel classes, quote lifted from the class 23 thread in this Heljan section:
Bigmet wrote:...Generally, provided the demand is there, it looks like every diesel type that ever ran on BR is going to get a RTR model as time goes on ... there's plenty of choice in the onesy-twosey department: Lion, DP2, LMS 10000/10001 for those who found the FIA trains price too steep, the three SR/EE prototypes, the Fell, and OK they aren't diesels but are still bogie boxes, Swindon's Kerosene Castles.


I would now guess that we are close to settled on this score; what we have had made available or is still shown as a goer from past announcements is pretty much it, I can imagine the prototype HST just 'making the cut' at the last minute. That's because development and production costs are rising sharply, and it is going to look too risky making the investment for a 'one off', when the same investment money will supply tooling for a class with numbers, long life, wide national distribution, many livery variations, enabling that tooling to be churned many times. There was a window of opportunity, but it is closing off fast...

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Sun Apr 05, 2015 8:30 pm

Bigmet,
the thing is that I like the look of the model rather than the 'look' of the prototype. I am not knowledgeable enough to compare the model to the prototype locomotive so Heljan's failure to get the nose curvature, the windows and the grilles correct is above my 'demands' on the model. I feel that going on the 'experts' in the other place, no manufacturer to date has modelled the 'correct' window shape on any model made. A read of the thread announcing the impending production of the stillborn Dapol DP2 had the manufacturer liasing with Shawplan to ensure that they got the right shape for the windows. Duplication does not help the market although it does introduce competition and hopefully a better end product. Rails have even moved any reference for the 'twins' from their homepage with apparently acknowledgement that the original release will most likely be the only release, whenever that occurs.

Some stores still have the DP2 well over GBP100.00 and yet the Liverpool store cannot shift them for GBP70.00. No surprise that Heljan (and others) have gone quiet on future releases.

Bigmet
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Bigmet » Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:30 pm

If you like it that's great, for me it jars; I saw the beast regularly, also DP1 and the class 55s. These were the small compensation for the loss of the Doncaster wide firebox power, at least the Deltics made such funky noises, and at a terrific volume level. It would never have got on the rails in the current environment...

Heljan seem to have recognised the error of their ways in the UK OO market, and are now adopting the righteous path of making steam models. They have an OO powered model release list of similar size to that which prevailed when they were making diesel and electric only, currently Gresley O2, 47xx, some sort of pannier tank, class 05 diesel, a railbus, are what I can quickly recall. The O2 samples seen so far are looking very nice indeed, my friend's Beyer-Garratt (Heljan's first UK steam essay in partnership with Hattons) is most impressive.

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:12 am

Until recently I was unable to access Hattons bargains due not having a mobile phone. When using a credit card for international purchases a mobile phone is required as a security code, delivered by SMS, is needed to verify the purchase enabling the purchase to proceed.

My bank has now provided me with a Netcode token and thus the Heljan bargains are now available to me. Thus armed with my Netcode token, a few more Heljan locomotives are now enroute. I scored a few class 23 diesels and two class 128 DPU parcel vans. Cost per unit was $128.00, including signed-for delivery. If purchased from a regular dealer the actual cost would be over $200.00 each plus postage.

I am still eyeing off "Lion" and a Metrovick class 28, but "Lion" would need a little weathering to tone down the stark white bogie sideframes and fuel tanks. Still undecided on those.

Bigmet
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Bigmet » Wed Apr 08, 2015 9:51 am

Lion does look unrealistic, in what must be one of the most impractical rail traction liveries of all time. But it really was kept as close to spotless as possible. BRCW kept a travelling technician with it full time - presumably shifts - and he was tasked with cleaning it whenever possible on layovers between working turns. The photos of Lion working do confirm this, it's typically pretty clean departing from a terminus with a service. Inevitably the bogie frames and underbody tanks darkened despite the cleaning. BRCW might have done better to paint these elements a cream tone.

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:35 am

Bigmet,
I like "Lion" as firstly it was a prototype and secondly it is an unusual looking loco (as is the Metrovick Cammell). If I get one then definite subtle weathering will be needed to tone down the bogies.

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SRman
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby SRman » Thu Apr 09, 2015 3:29 am

I have to agree with Bigmet's comments. Most of the time Lion was kept sparkling clean, including all the "dirty bits" like bogies, underframe components, and buffers. I have seen only one picture of Lion with any degree of dirt on it, and that was mostly brownish dirt on the lower body and undergear.

I want to apply just a little weathering to my model's bogies, particularly the springs, where there should be a little space between the 'coils'. However, I'm afraid that if I try a thin wash of grey or black it will actually discolour the whole bogie rather than just filling the gaps I want coloured. I don't think I am capable of painting the spaces between the 'coils' with black myself as that is just a little too fine for me to do.

Any ideas would be welcome.

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Thu Apr 09, 2015 5:39 am

SRman,
you could paint the frames and then use a water soluble wash to weather. Any excess could be wiped off with a damp cloth or brush. If you apply a wash straight to the unpainted frames then the plastic would discolour.

Pennine MC
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby Pennine MC » Thu Apr 09, 2015 7:35 am

GWR_fan wrote:SRman,
you could paint the frames and then use a water soluble wash to weather. Any excess could be wiped off with a damp cloth or brush. ...


That's the way I'd do it (although I'd use enamels, that's personal preference as I'm used to them). A wash, wiped off on raised parts, is a pretty standard method of getting paint into detail.

GWR_fan
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby GWR_fan » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:17 am

Now other than initial publicity photographs, this is how I would view "Lion" in operation -

http://album.atomic-systems.com/showPic ... LionKX.jpg

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SRman
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Re: Heljan DP2

Postby SRman » Thu Apr 09, 2015 12:33 pm

Yes, I think that's the same one and only pic I had seen of it being dirty.

Thanks for the suggestions, too, guys. :)


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