HS2 phase two

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luckymucklebackit
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HS2 phase two

Postby luckymucklebackit » Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:41 am

Maps and diagrams now available to view on line.

https://www.gov.uk/hs2-phase-two-initial-preferred-route-plan-and-profile-maps#route-map-west-midlands-to-manchester

Should stimulate some interesting debate!!

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Bufferstop
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby Bufferstop » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:23 am

Hardly going to break any records for speed of construction is it? I just hope I'm still around to ride it, perhaps my grand kids will take me on it for a birthday treat. Still, I'll add it to the list of things that have to be done before I'm ready to go.
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b308
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby b308 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:33 am

I was looking at those earlier. Note that all three major stations (Birmingham, Leeds and Manchester) are on spurs from the main line, so any through train will have to reverse at each station. I have to say that I'm not impressed with that at all, seems like you'll lose a lot of the benefit of HS travel. I still can't see the need for it to be 250mph, though, it just seems like one-upmanship and over the distances traveled will make very little difference...

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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby D605Eagle » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:54 am

When you consider how much the upgrade of the WCML cost and how long it took I just can't see this line been built anywhere near the costs they are quoting. As it follows the WCML so closely for much of its distance it makes you wonder why £12 billion was wasted on the WCML upgrade. The whole thing stinks of not having a proper well thought out long term plan for railways.
Personally I think that the money earmarked for this project would be much better spent on tackling localized congestion problems with various line reopenings, line improvements, out of town park and ride schemes. In my opinion an integrated transport scheme is whats needed, not a flash high speed route that will benefit very few.
Last edited by D605Eagle on Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

b308
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby b308 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:11 am

Totally agree, it's just a vanity project so that the MPs can strut their stuff when abroad, if the money were spent elsewhere on the railways it would have much more impact on many millions of people rather than the few thousand this will. As far as I know it follows the Chiltern route more than the WCML in the initial HS2 stage, though north of Brum it inevitably follows the WCML... Some foreign train manufacturer will also make some money out of it, just like ICExpress, perhaps if we did leave the EU we could start building our own trains again...

The problem, as you say, is that there is no integrated Public Transport plan in the UK...

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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby GarrettTheThief » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:03 pm

D605Eagle wrote:Personally I think that the money earmarked for this project would be much better spent on tackling localized congestion problems with various line reopenings, line improvements, out of town park and ride schemes. In my opinion an integrated transport scheme is whats needed, not a flash high speed route that will benefit very few.


That's my personal take on this. There need to be more direct intercity services that don't require making at least two changes in your journey.

EDIT: And London Midland could do with better management.
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby beeman » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:38 pm

Won't bother me at my age but be interesting to see if 'They' sell us out AGAIN to Germany or France. Like our lorry manufacturers, 'bus builders, power generation companies. Train builders, the list goes on. How did BAE escape ??.When will the British public 'wise up', Whats the betting the 'trains' wont be British.
Resurrect 'Churchill' or a replacement, or is it too late. Re sensible stopping points Ought it to Stop at East Mid Airport, a major tranport 'Hub'.I believe it will zoom past underground, or are they trying to avoid air travel connections ? Beeman
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D605Eagle
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby D605Eagle » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:46 pm

Most likely the trains and engineering will be of Chinese origin. Something to do with the Chinese lending us a shed load of dosh and getting the best pickings of contracts in return. Expect to see thorium reactor power stations been built here by the Chinese and the power being sold to us at vast expense in 20 odd years time so we'll never escape the energy barons all because short sighted politicians cannot see beyond the next election, but I digress......

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ASFC
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby ASFC » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:59 pm

Projects like HS2 are needed, regardless of other details like which route it follows.

Those who complain that this is just a vanity project for MPs fail to realise that in the far east, they are building new high speed rail lines/airports/cities/roads at an astronomical rate. If we ever want to get out of our economic duldrums and create jobs then we have to be able to compete with these markets. Whether that is HS2, or more Airports, or opening more 'classic' lines, it needs to be done!

As for upgrading the WCML-I think they learnt that lesson the hardway after the £12 Billion mess they made last time, and they still didn't get all the improvements they wanted.......
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GarrettTheThief
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby GarrettTheThief » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:30 pm

I think that claiming its a vanity project is a poor reason to be against it, but my issue is that I don't think that the benefits will outweight the costs, regardless of which cities are served by this line (though I'm open to being wrong about this). That's why I don't have a lot of confidence in the project.
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby beeman » Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:41 pm

Just imagine if ' a terrorist' blew out a rail on a City outskirts. I wonder at 250 mph how far it would travel before stopping. and the damage created. ????.You'll likely find out one day.Those around that is. Beeman.
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TK421
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby TK421 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:35 pm

beeman wrote:Just imagine if ' a terrorist' blew out a rail on a City outskirts. I wonder at 250 mph how far it would travel before stopping. and the damage created. ????.You'll likely find out one day.Those around that is. Beeman.


I hope your not palnning anything sinister beeman :lol:
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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby johnco » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:23 pm

Liverpool misses out once again. Why not have a link through to Dublin via a tunnel from Holyhead and?connections to Europe (sorry naughty word) via HS1
Possible terrorism is no excuse not to have anything.

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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby ollieollieollie » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:27 pm

beeman wrote:Just imagine if ' a terrorist' blew out a rail on a City outskirts. I wonder at 250 mph how far it would travel before stopping. and the damage created. ????.You'll likely find out one day.Those around that is. Beeman.



What a negative, sensationalist load of rubbish. Comments like that are best kept to oneself.

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Re: HS2 phase two

Postby 6C » Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:35 pm

beeman wrote:Just imagine if ' a terrorist' blew out a rail on a City outskirts. I wonder at 250 mph how far it would travel before stopping. and the damage created. ????.You'll likely find out one day.Those around that is. Beeman.


I think you are crediting the average religious or political loon with far more brains then they actually have....
BTW - stop giving those cretins ideas !! :wink:
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