Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

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ngresley
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby ngresley » Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:55 am

forest446 wrote:An just to reopen the can of worms on the speed debate ask the driver of tornado who was fired last year how quick he was going.
as thats the reason A1 steam had him removed it was over the 100 mark.
i was told 115 an there was "fair bit left"


Is there any corroborating evidence for this (eg GPS?) because AFAIK that would be the fastest post-WW2 run by a steam loco.

What was she hauling?
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flying scotsman123
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby flying scotsman123 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 6:23 pm

bocaj wrote:Shame I won't be able to ride behind FS at Barrow hill, but there is always still Tornado and Dominion of New Zealand/Bittern.
:D


i thought that would be happening too, but they just sat their, smoking :D
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poliss
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby poliss » Fri Oct 26, 2012 6:52 pm

The report into the restoration has been published today. There's a summary on the NRM website but I would urge those interested to email the NRM and they will send you a PDF of the report for you to read. The email address is pressoffice@nrm.org.uk

Summary of the report at http://nrm.org.uk/AboutUs/PressOffice/P ... eport.aspx
Here's just one sentence in the report that is missing from the summary. "Following the discovery of additional problems,completion is now anticipated in late 2013."

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PeterH
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby PeterH » Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:23 pm

I helped out a fortnight ago with the restoration, fitting shaft onto it; going through the frame. She's getting there, slowly but surely.
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby bocaj » Sat Oct 27, 2012 7:41 pm

More delays? I guess it was expected, I think that the money should be spent on different projects, and not tones of it spent on FS. I know people donated most of it, but I think it should have still been put towards other projects.

Jacob :)

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poliss
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby poliss » Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:22 pm

There was no money to spend on other projects Jacob. The grants and the money raised were for 4472 only.
It's not the spending of the money that bothers me. It's the totally shambolic way the project has been handled.

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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby bocaj » Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:38 pm

Oh right, I guess that people just want to see her running. How many mistakes could the NRM make in overhauling her. Nice way to spend your 90th birthday year, in bits around the country. You'd think that the NRM could take some consideration into making it a quick overhaul, as a lot of people want to see her running and people must be wondering what there donations are actually been spent on, with all the mistakes and problems going on.

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poliss
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby poliss » Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:18 pm

That was one of the problems Jacob. They tried a rush job to get her running when what they should have done was make a thorough inspection first. Email them to see the report for yourself.

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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby bocaj » Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:00 am

I think I will email them to see it, it will be interesting to see what's really going on. No loco's restoration should be rushed, they need to be done carefully to make sure everything is done to the best standard. Flying Scotsman is a example of why not to rush locomotive restorations, it was supped to be done quickly, and now look at it, it's getting on to 7 years late according to the NRMs first date it was supposed to be running by, which was 2006 I think.

Jacob :)

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PeterH
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby PeterH » Sun Oct 28, 2012 10:09 am

The main problem is that 4472 has had so many bodge jobs over the years which the NRM now have to correct. Some of the cracks that they keep finding are hidden under sheets of metal welded over said problems. These issues aren't found until that part has been disassembled. Most of the parts of the locomotive are completely new. She was in a considerably worse state than any newspaper report has made out. A rare case of the media under exaggerating the case.

The tender is completely finished though (other than the correct paint job).
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poliss
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby poliss » Sun Oct 28, 2012 1:27 pm

The whole report makes depressing reading. Here are some extracts from it.

3. NRM failed to undertake an adequate investigation of the condition of the locomotive, either when it first took ownership or at the start of the refurbishment.

4. For much of the time, project management was ineffectual or non-existent.

From the Conclusions and key findings.
The museum did not make an adequate assessment of the state of the locomotive after purchase. Consequently there was never a credible refurbishment plan and new faults took staff by surprise, even 5 years after purchase. Inadequate attention was paid to the detailed examination of the locomotive structure once it was stripped down. In particular, serious latent defects in the locomotive frame were not detected, resulting in extensive, costly and embarrassing rework.

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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby bocaj » Sun Oct 28, 2012 3:09 pm

You'd think the NRM could take some care into the worlds most famous loco, some of the mistakes you mentioned are very bad, and insufficient project management, how could that happen on any loco?

Jacob :)

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Tiddles
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby Tiddles » Sun Oct 28, 2012 3:57 pm

Is it not time to have this loco stuffed and mounted?

There are many other locos in the collection in need of restoration and possibly requiring less work/cost.

My personal favourites are Evening Star and the Stirling Single. Is it not better to concentrate on locos like these than keep throwing money in to the bottomless pit that is Flying Scotsman?

I too love the Scotsman and am proud that we have such a loco in the national collection. But like when I had to scrap (I am NOT suggesting scrapping the Scotsman) my faithful beloved Vauxhall Frontera you sometimes have let reality take control instead of heart and move on.
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poliss
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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby poliss » Sun Oct 28, 2012 4:06 pm

The NRM started a fund for the restoration of 4472. They asked for donations from the public and grants from the Heritage Lottery Fund and Tata Steel. There was no pot of money to be spent on restoring other locos or projects. For instance, the NRM asked for a grant to upgrade the Great Hall and were refused. http://www.museumsassociation.org/museu ... s-facelift

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Re: Update on 4472 'Flying Scotsman'

Postby bocaj » Sun Oct 28, 2012 4:12 pm

Another reason they did not choose to overhaul a different loco like Evening Star (Which I think the NRM have already said they won't run) or The Duchess of Hamilton is because people won't donate to see them running, where as alot more people will donate to see Flying Scotsman running.


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