Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

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krusty
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Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby krusty » Sun May 12, 2013 4:24 pm

I have an old Hornby IC125 from the 80's that I will be converting for DCC. The power car isn't an issue, I have hardwired plenty of decoders.
My question concerns the dummy cars lighting. Without modification will the car be ok? I don't want to damage the lighting unit. I guess the lighting will stay on all of the time, in the near future I intend to fit a decoder that will control the lighting in the correct manor. Is there a cheap decoder suited to this task? Or is it just a easy to use a normal cheapo decoder with motor control?

Krusty.

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Roger (RJ)
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Roger (RJ) » Sun May 12, 2013 4:49 pm

I'd just use a normal decoder. All the function only decoders I've looked at in the past seem to be more expensive.

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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby GWR_fan » Mon May 13, 2013 11:24 am

Unfortunately at present this seller is not selling any units but these are a direct install for the Hornby HST dummy or powered car. For DCC a decoder is required for lighting direction change. Any cheap decoder is suitable as you are only using the lighting function.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Hornby-HST-L ... 198wt_1255

Tim

krusty
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby krusty » Tue May 14, 2013 8:49 pm

Thanks guys, It seems a little strange the function only chips are so expensive. I have a few basic Hornby chips I am slowly upgrading to the Gaugemaster Opti chips, so I'll use one of these in the dummy car. The dual colour lighting units look like a nice upgrade, might have to wait till next month for those as this months railway budget is spent. I know the new Hornby HST is a pretty decent model but I have had these since I was about 9, so I hope you will forgive some nostalgia. :D

R.Daneel
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby R.Daneel » Wed Jun 05, 2013 12:41 am

krusty wrote:I have an old Hornby IC125 from the 80's that I will be converting for DCC. The power car isn't an issue, I have hardwired plenty of decoders.
Krusty.


Krusty, I too have an IC125 circa 1982, part of the R332 High Speed Train Pack, and have been looking at the power car trying to work out how to DCC it. How did you do yours?

From looking at the wiring on mine, it seems that there are two brown wires coming from the front bogie. One goes to the front bulb and the other goes to the side of the motor unit. The other side of the bulb, also brown (go figure!), goes via a diode(?) to the outside of the motor.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks in Advance
R.Daneel

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Flashbang
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Flashbang » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:07 am

Hi

Firstly and before you convert to DCC the unit must run faultlessly on dc power. Any hesitancy to start or poor general running must be resolved before conversion is undertaken. Failure to do this and it is a poor runner will result in it being far worse on DCC! If you can't resolve poor running then don't bother trying to convert it.

Assuming all is good with the running then obtain the best quality of decoder you can afford. Older motors respond better to up market decoders plus they offer the options of fine tuning the decoder to the motor via CV settings (Not if you have a Hornby Select or Bachmann EZ Command as these cannot alter CVs directly!) I recommend a Zimo, Lenz Silver or Gold, DCC Concepts or a TCS decoder.

Remove all wires from the motor terminals. Also remove any capacitor across the motor too its no longer needed with DCC.

Test with the aid of of multimeter or a battery powered buzzer each motors tag to all the wheels of the power bogie. There must not be any connection found. If any is found it MUST be removed before proceeding. Failure to remove any connection will result in immediate decoder failure when DCC power is applied. How to remove any connection is a separate issue and you will have to post back saying you have discovered a connection and then be given more advice.

Assuming all is ok and no connection is found or any discovered has been removed, then....
Solder decoders Orange and Grey wires to the motor tags where the former wires were removed from.
The two wires from the bogie wheels connect to the decoders red and black wires. If there is only one wire from one sides wheels then connect that to the red decoder wire and the black then has to be connected onto the metal of the motor bogie chassis somehow - use an existing screw with the black wire underneath its head etc.

Light... Assuming there is only a forward white light, then remove the diode and connect the decoders white wire to one wire coming from the lamp and the decoders blue wire to the other wire coming from the lamp.
F0 will then turn on/off the headlight and it will be directional, illuminating only in the forward direction with FO on.
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Broken? It was working correctly when I left it.

R.Daneel
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby R.Daneel » Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:00 pm

Many thanks Flashbang...

I've already converted a number of my older engines to DCC, using TCS M1 or TCS T1 decoders and I intend to mod the lighting by adding white and red LED's for the directional lighting, and will also be using a TCS FL2 in the dummy car.

The problem I had, as mentioned, was that there were more wires on the motor block than I had seen before, and this was causing me some consernation.

I'll let you know how things went!

Thanks again
R.

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Flashbang
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Flashbang » Wed Jun 05, 2013 3:54 pm

Hi
Proceed as before but for the lighting....
No need to use any former factory wires to the lights Just the fine decoder wires will be OK.
Use white decoder wire to the white Headlamp LED Anode (longer LED lead of the LEDs two) and Yellow decoder wire to Red trailing LED Anode (again longer LED lead). Both via resistors wired in line to each LED. Actual values of the two resistors will depend on the brightness required for each of the LEDs, but start off with 1K5 to 4K7 and see how they look. Use 0.25 (1/4) watt resistors if possible as they are smaller. Connect together LEDs Cathodes and and connect them to the decoders Blue wire.
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thebritfarmer
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby thebritfarmer » Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:36 pm

But no one as actually answered the OPs original question which was can the dummy car run as is on DCC without a decoder?
All Aboooooard !!

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Flashbang
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Flashbang » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:42 pm

thebritfarmer wrote:But no one as actually answered the OPs original question which was can the dummy car run as is on DCC without a decoder?

The answer is yes it can. But the head light will be on all the time.
Therefore a decoder in the unpowered car is really essential and basically just use the cheapest decoder available - Motor plus function or function only whichever is the cheapest.

My replies above were to R Daneel's question.
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thebritfarmer
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby thebritfarmer » Thu Jun 06, 2013 2:54 am

Cheers FB for your answer.
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Musicpuppy1
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Musicpuppy1 » Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:57 am

Hi.

I'm new here, and relatively new to model railway digital.
I too have an old Hornby hst, with only white lighting in both power and dummy car.
Hard wiring DCC power unit with the light is ok, but what is the best thing to do for the dummy car light?
Can it work without a decider, or will it need a decider for he light. Will it then work by function on and off...independently of the power car lights?
How do you wire it?
If it needs a separate decoder, will it have the same address as the power car decoder?
Using bachmann ez controller.

Thanks for your help

Darren

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Flashbang
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Flashbang » Fri Jan 29, 2016 11:29 am

Hi
I think most of your questions have been answered above in the other posts.

The rear units headlight will light on DCC without alteration, but will always be on.

Fit a decoder and perhaps two red rear lights too. Then wire decoder Blue wire to all LEDs positives (Anodes) The decoder White wire to the white reverse direction headlamp and the red LEDs to the Yellow wire. Not forgetting to add suitable series resistors to the LEDs. Alternative is to perhaps use an Express Models lighting module for that unit (Assuming they produce one?) for DCC use plus a decoder of choice.
Decoders Red and Black wires connect to the wheels of the rear unit.

You may have to swap the normal direction of travel if the LEDs light the wrong way or simpler as you only have a basic DCC system is to swap the yellow and white wires around on their LEDs.

You would normally use the same address and the motor unit has then it follows the main drive units decoder.
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Musicpuppy1
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Re: Hornby Dummy HST car on DCC

Postby Musicpuppy1 » Fri Jan 29, 2016 11:36 pm

Thank you all so much.....massive help. :D

Hi.

I'm new here, and relatively new to model railway digital.
I too have an old Hornby hst, with only white lighting in both power and dummy car.
Hard wiring DCC power unit with the light is ok, but what is the best thing to do for the dummy car light?
Can it work without a decider, or will it need a decider for he light. Will it then work by function on and off...independently of the power car lights?
How do you wire it?
If it needs a separate decoder, will it have the same address as the power car decoder?
Using bachmann ez controller.

Thanks for your help

Darren


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