Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

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Yojic
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Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Yojic » Sat Jun 23, 2012 12:11 pm

No doubt this subject has been covered before! Coverting this feisty little loco to DCC. This little tutorial hopefully will be easy to follow and understand. :D
Firstly the loco should run smoothly on DC. If not, give it a service. To find out what decoder to install you would need to find what the stall current is by way of an ammeter etc. For this loco I used a TCS M1 1amp continuous and 2amp Peak as the loco ran smoothly and had a very low stall current!

Diesel dock shunter 3 b.jpg
Diesel dock shunter 3 b.jpg (190.26 KiB) Viewed 5257 times


As can be seen in next photos the wheel sets have been changed out for the smooth type, to allow running on new track and points (peco etc) The old knurled type, shorts out going across points.

Diesel dock shunter 2 b.jpg
Diesel dock shunter 2 b.jpg (240.54 KiB) Viewed 5257 times



Remove all the wireing from the loco apart from the half the wire on the pick up spring.

Next is to insulate the "V Bush Spring" I used black 1.5mm heat shrink x 2 for the uninsulated side (Both sides insulated)


The next photo is where the decoders wires attach to.

Diesel Dock Shunter 1 b.jpg
Diesel Dock Shunter 1 b.jpg (187.06 KiB) Viewed 5257 times


1/ Orange decoder wire soldered to R/H top Brush contact.
2/ Grey decoder wire soldered to L/H top Brush contact.
3/ Red decoder wire soldered to the wheel pick up wire.
4/ Black decoder wire soldered to the back earthing eyelet.

Remove all the wireing from the loco apart from the wire on the pick up spring. Solder the Orange wire to the small tab on the right hand Brush (see photo) and solder the other three decoder wires accordingly.

Diesel Dock Shunter 5.png
Diesel Dock Shunter 5.png (20.03 KiB) Viewed 5257 times


And the rest like so.........

Diesel dock shunter 4 b.jpg
Diesel dock shunter 4 b.jpg (185.87 KiB) Viewed 5257 times


Test on programming track with DCC controller. All should be OK. Incidently the loco in the photos runs very sweet and down to a crawl of 1mph!

For the headlamp I used a 3mm white LED. A 470Ohm resistor soldered to the +ve side (long side of LED) and the Blue common decoder wire soldered to the resistor, do not forget to slip heat shrink on the blue wire before hand for insulation.
Solder to white decoder wire to the LED -ve (short wire) Again do not forget to slip heat shrink on the white wire.

The LED, black/blue tacked in position on the body. LED works on F0 function on your controller.

Simple :) :) :)

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pete12345
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby pete12345 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 11:56 pm

These little motors are used in virtually all triang power bogies, and a very similar version turns up in a lot of older hornby locos including the generic 0-6-0 chassis. They work quite well on DCC and are a doddle to convert as everything is open. Surprisingly good slow running too when back EMF is used :)
Once an engine attached to a train, was afraid of a few drops of rain...

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Bufferstop
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Bufferstop » Sun Jun 24, 2012 5:44 pm

If you are buying new wheelsets for one of these bogies, get all insulated wheels and fit a second set of pickup wipers to the keeper plate. If you put sleeving on the bare half of the brush spring you then have a fully insulated mechanism, which makes fitting a decoder even easier.
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Yojic
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Yojic » Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:19 am

Bufferstop wrote:If you are buying new wheelsets for one of these bogies, get all insulated wheels and fit a second set of pickup wipers to the keeper plate. If you put sleeving on the bare half of the brush spring you then have a fully insulated mechanism, which makes fitting a decoder even easier.
Bufferstop

Where did I say to buy new wheelsets? You do not have to, but it runs better with a smooth set as explained. :)
"get all insulated wheels and fit a second set of pickup wipers to the keeper plate" Why? When it works perfectly with one. What if you do not have a set of spare pick up wipers? :roll:
"if you put sleeving on the bare half of the brush spring you then have a fully insulated mechanism" " Already said that "Next is to insulate the "V Bush Spring" I used black 1.5mm heat shrink x 2 for the uninsulated side (Both sides insulated)" :roll:
" which makes fitting a decoder even easier" Easier is it :|

Out of interest, where can you get New wheelsets for these locos that are insulated? They have been around for over 30 years!

No disrespect "Bufferstop" I do not mind constructive critisism where it is due, it will be welcome, I still have a lot to learn on the more complicated conversions such with the european models that are far more difficult, but thanks for the comments. If you can find an easier and more cost effective way, then post a tutorial. This is a quick tutorial for someone who is venturing into DCC, I did not have to do it. Also Some of the spare parts for these locos are hard to find. I have two of these that are non working and I am in the process of trying to find spares for these. There are a few whole ones out there, but you do not often find the correct spares when you need them.

Rgds

Dave

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Forfarian
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Forfarian » Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:13 pm

I think you touched a bare wire there Bufferstop :roll:
Tim
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Bufferstop
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Bufferstop » Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:10 pm

Yes Forfarian I admit I did and here's my response to Dave that I was already in the process of composing.

No criticism intended Dave. It was a good description of what needed doing. Over the years there must have been three or four different wheel profiles, not counting the knurled ones. Your one must have the final type. Just about all the others need replacing, and as you surmise you can't get Hornby ones. You can however get third party ones, originally intended for conversion of Triang Hornby models to scale wheel standards. Not only are the wheels available they can be bought as complete sets ready to drop in, so there's a strong likelihood that someone else doing the same conversion is already contemplating a replacement wheelset.

Your method shows that there's not any great difficulty in doing the conversion, but many modellers give up completely on DCC conversions of older locos because they are worried by the risk of the decoder coming into contact with a live chassis. Removing that risk and with it the source of their apprehension requires insulation in two places, at the brush springs and at the wheels. Your sleeving of the V spring isolates the chassis from the motor connections, and using insulated wheels removes the connection between wheel and chassis.

I hope you can see that I added my comment not to belittle your post but to help overcome the fears of those who having read it would still hold back because matters electrical are still to them a black art.

Please never feel put out that some one adds to your post, if you hadn't posted in the first place they would probably not have come forward with the extra information, and teasing out all the information around, is one of the many goals of a forum.

John W
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Yojic
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Yojic » Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:22 pm

No propblem John, just a bit of tongue in cheek. As they say there are many ways to skin a cat! Incidently the photo is of an old Triang, the one with the knurled wheels, just swaped them out from another chassis with smooth wheels that had a worn armature and no good for DCC.

The method I used, as pete12345 mentioned covers most of the early Triang, Triang/Hornby power bogies X03/X04 0-4-0, 0-6-0, 2-6-2, 2-6-4 chassis etc. But as you say, I would use your method on isolating the wheelsets on 0-6-0, 2-6-2 etc as they would be more likely to short out on points etc. and putting extra pick ups on both sides, remembering to wire the black wire to left pick up and red to the right pick up, with the motor isolated at the "V" Brush springs. In general it is simple to DCC any non DCC ready loco (apart from the split chassis ones, tutorial coming for that as well when I get time). I just tried to make it very basic as a first time for those who want to attempt converting DC to DCC locos. :D :D

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Bufferstop
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Re: Triang/Hornby R253 Diesel Dock Shunter DCC Conversion

Postby Bufferstop » Mon Jun 25, 2012 3:13 pm

Yes do write your split chassis tutorial. It's a shame that split chassis has come to stand for unreliable. It's time wouldn't have been up until DCC was well established if Mainline hadn't chosen such a cr*p way of implementing it. The variations on those bogie wheels is amazing. I've come across two revised versions of the knurled ones, one with a slightly narrower tread, the other with a shallower flange. The smooth ones seem to have entered a period of continuous refinement, the earliest wouldn't run on code 100 rail without bumping on the sleepers and forget set track points. I can identify at least four differences in which they gradually reduced the depth and thickness of the flanges and the tread width. The best of them will even run on code 75 plain track. I don't think it ever made it to the dock shunter but one version of the bogie had all plain wheels on a one piece nylon axle and wormwheel, so that one had to have two sets of pickups.
Cheers
John W
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