The BNR (another way)

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sat Nov 03, 2018 12:10 pm

The need for diesels during the winter low season means that the BNR's paint-shop have sped things up to clear the backlog. Two of the BNR's best running diesel have been out of action since last winter awaiting modifications and repainting.

No 3 is a Lima Hornby hybrid running on an 0-6-0 chassis and is one of the BNR's earliest locos. It originally had a Mainline J72 chassis, but that became unreliable and crews were not happy with the limited space in the cab. This was replaced with a Hornby Toby chassis, but this had to be replaced due to corrosion issues. A second Toby chassis was then fitted. The loco in this form always seemed a little unbalanced and so it entered the works again for modification to the chassis mounts and some other improvements.

BNR_No3.JPG


No 9 is a modified Hornby Class 06 with a replacement, more controllable, power unit (Johnson 111) and changes in weight distribution to improve haulage on the line's steep gradients.

BNR_No9.JPG


No 11 is a Bachmann Junior diesel with the addition of suspension to the rear wheel set, an improved exhaust and changes to the weight distribution. Visibility through the cab windows has been enhanced and access to the front engine doors improved.

BNR_No11.JPG
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sun Nov 11, 2018 3:23 pm

Every now and then rolling stock gets damaged in shunting accidents. It sometimes seems difficult carry out a repair when bits get broken off, but the BNR's workshop staff have developed a fairly successful technique. Milliput was initially tried, but it did not form a strong enough bond with the remaining parts for small repairs. JB Weld and possibly other Epoxy glues do however seem to provide a solution.

LowmacBuffer.JPG


In this case part of a Lowmac's buffer head had sheared off. Initially a blob of JB Weld was placed over the missing area, after a few hours it partially sets and can be cut back with a sharp knife. When completely dry, it can be filed down to match the original item. The repair is nearly as strong as the original and once painted is hard to spot.
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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Dave
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Dave » Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:07 pm

Interesting, thanks Gerald

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:55 pm

After months of delays the BNR's rebuilt No 3 and modified No 9 have been released from the paint shop and entered service. Depot staff got a bit carried away and put No 9 on the mainline passenger service this evening where it nearly got stuck on the bank. No 3 had an easier job on the night mail to Ivygale.

BNR3_Complete.JPG


BNR9_Complete.JPG
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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Mountain
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Mountain » Sat Nov 17, 2018 8:12 pm

GeraldH wrote:The need for diesels during the winter low season means that the BNR's paint-shop have sped things up to clear the backlog. Two of the BNR's best running diesel have been out of action since last winter awaiting modifications and repainting.

No 3 is a Lima Hornby hybrid running on an 0-6-0 chassis and is one of the BNR's earliest locos. It originally had a Mainline J72 chassis, but that became unreliable and crews were not happy with the limited space in the cab. This was replaced with a Hornby Toby chassis, but this had to be replaced due to corrosion issues. A second Toby chassis was then fitted. The loco in this form always seemed a little unbalanced and so it entered the works again for modification to the chassis mounts and some other improvements.

BNR_No3.JPG

No 9 is a modified Hornby Class 06 with a replacement, more controllable, power unit (Johnson 111) and changes in weight distribution to improve haulage on the line's steep gradients.

BNR_No9.JPG

No 11 is a Bachmann Junior diesel with the addition of suspension to the rear wheel set, an improved exhaust and changes to the weight distribution. Visibility through the cab windows has been enhanced and access to the front engine doors improved.

BNR_No11.JPG

You mention corrosion issues. Where would the corrosion be? My Toby is basically new so runs brilliantly, though its not really run in as yet as it has hardly been anywhere. You have given me an idea that I can use the chassis and make a 7mm narrow gauge loco from my Lima loco but I do admit that with a decent clean my Lima loco runs OK.
You've given me an idea. The chassis is excellent so... I have a plan... :)

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sat Nov 17, 2018 9:41 pm

Mountain wrote:
GeraldH wrote:... No 3 is a Lima Hornby hybrid running on an 0-6-0 chassis and is one of the BNR's earliest locos. It originally had a Mainline J72 chassis, but that became unreliable and crews were not happy with the limited space in the cab. This was replaced with a Hornby Toby chassis, but this had to be replaced due to corrosion issues....


You mention corrosion issues. Where would the corrosion be? My Toby is basically new so runs brilliantly, though its not really run in as yet as it has hardly been anywhere. You have given me an idea that I can use the chassis and make a 7mm narrow gauge loco from my Lima loco but I do admit that with a decent clean my Lima loco runs OK.
You've given me an idea. The chassis is excellent so... I have a plan... :)


I've had two Hornby Toby chassis disintegrate due to mazak rot. Others have reported the same problem. If your chassis is still running well, it must be from one of the good batches :) . As Hormby seem to be dropping their Thomas range, Tobys and spares might be a bit hard to find in the future :( . The Oxford Rail Janus looks like it might provide be a good, albeit rather expensive, alternative chassis to Toby.

The original Lima chassis was a good runner, but as you say it needed a lot of wheel cleaning and was definitely built for speed :) .
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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Mountain
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Mountain » Sat Nov 17, 2018 10:02 pm

I never knew the Toby chassis suffered from chassis rot. Someone recently asked me. I will give mine a second check, but I have to say that the last time I had the body off which was for a good few years as I was going to use it with a kit, that there was no signs as I would have noticed. It runs sweetly. I think I will take it off sale and use it. It is too good to part with. :lol: Too useful. :D

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Bufferstop
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Bufferstop » Sat Nov 17, 2018 10:27 pm

That's the curse of MAZAK rot, it's patchy within the batch, and inconsistent in its timing, you can never be sure it won't appear in the next few days, and all because the monkey who tipped the sack of zinc into the pot threw in the lead seal from the sack.
Growing old, can't avoid it. Growing up, forget it!
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Mountain
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Mountain » Sun Nov 18, 2018 2:49 am

Not having had a sign of rot in my Toby chassis (Though I am going to check again just incase!), it is hard to imagine what the results would look like for those which it has effected. I believe mine was one of the last which Hornby made (Unless they have just come out with a new batch?) which I purchased around 2011-2012 or there abouts. It wasn't cheap, but I was willing to pay the price to use it for a 7mm narrow gauge kit. The kits had already been selling for a couple of years and it seemed that the Toby prices were already rising fast. From watching Hattons sell their last few of the previous batches in bulk for nearly half the price I paid for mine.... I thought back then that they were becoming scarce. I just assumed Hornby would make another batch, but they never did unless they have just come out with them now.

This mazak rot issue is scary stuff. I have only ever had a small issue with a single loco which after a very small amount was filed off the chassis, it had settled down and was ok. It may just have been a poor fitting chassis compared to the body so probably isn't mazak rot at all. The real anoying thing is that I now want to remove the bodies of every model loco I have to check them as I would not want to sell any with a problem, which is quite a job ahead of me!

I love the livery of BNR locos and the way you keep them on the rails. Quite a challenge at times I guess. Regarding 0-4-0 chassis like the Lima diesel started off with, I have had thoughts of a small skate like pickup to contact the track for additional electrical contact, something like the G scale 0-4-0 locos have.

I must get some sleep now as it is rather late and I don't want to be checking hundreds of locos! :lol: It would take me days!

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sun Nov 18, 2018 10:47 am

Just to give you an idea of what to look out for, here are some images of rotted Toby chassis. You can see that attempts at repair were made when one of the chassis mounting clip snapped off, but resistance is futile.

RottenToby3.JPG

RottenToby2.JPG
RottenToby2.JPG (38.32 KiB) Viewed 538 times

RottenToby1.JPG
RottenToby1.JPG (36.86 KiB) Viewed 538 times


Touch wood the three BNR loco that currently use these chassis are from a different production batch, as they are currently running well. Crazing of the paintwork is one of the first signs, followed by erratic running as the gears go out of mesh. I did contact Hornby at the time, but after an initial reply that they'd look into it, it all went very quiet :( .
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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Mountain
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Mountain » Sun Nov 18, 2018 12:36 pm

Though it may take a bit of work, would it be an idea for you to make a new chassis using brass frames? Would one be able to design it in such a way as to sit the gears and motor in the right place? I realize that it would not be easy with the double reduction gears.
If it is do-able, it could be your answer.
I was thinking of making my own chassis for the ordinary Hornby 0-4-0's to run on. Years ago I tried but in those days I couldn't figure out a method to attach the motor. Today, armed with experience I believe I can make it work. :)

Kindling
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Kindling » Sun Nov 18, 2018 2:20 pm

There may be another solution.
Firstly, I have to emphasise that I have never seen these chassis in the metal, but if you study Hornby Service Sheets 250 (Toby) and 265 (Bill and Ben), you will see that the main chassis blocks (i.e. the only part not given a part number) are common to both. It therefore follows that if you bought a Bill or Ben, stripped everything off the chassis (possibly with the exception of item numbers 1,2,3 and 4) and then attached the corresponding parts from an "infected" Toby chassis, you should be on to a winner. I suppose now the problem is getting a Hornby Bill or Ben at a sensible price.
It seems wasteful that these chassis, having being designed and developed, are now just going to be abandoned.
May the engineering staff of BNR continue their great work. As the BNR correspondent, it is your duty to report regularly!

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sun Nov 18, 2018 4:35 pm

Kindling wrote:There may be another solution.
Firstly, I have to emphasise that I have never seen these chassis in the metal, but if you study Hornby Service Sheets 250 (Toby) and 265 (Bill and Ben), you will see that the main chassis blocks (i.e. the only part not given a part number) are common to both. It therefore follows that if you bought a Bill or Ben, stripped everything off the chassis (possibly with the exception of item numbers 1,2,3 and 4) and then attached the corresponding parts from an "infected" Toby chassis, you should be on to a winner. I suppose now the problem is getting a Hornby Bill or Ben at a sensible price.
It seems wasteful that these chassis, having being designed and developed, are now just going to be abandoned.
May the engineering staff of BNR continue their great work. As the BNR correspondent, it is your duty to report regularly!


You are spot on! Some of the BNR's Toby chassis have been rebuilt with parts from Bill and Ben :) .
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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GeraldH
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby GeraldH » Sun Nov 18, 2018 4:50 pm

Mountain wrote:Though it may take a bit of work, would it be an idea for you to make a new chassis using brass frames? Would one be able to design it in such a way as to sit the gears and motor in the right place? I realize that it would not be easy with the double reduction gears.
If it is do-able, it could be your answer.
I was thinking of making my own chassis for the ordinary Hornby 0-4-0's to run on. Years ago I tried but in those days I couldn't figure out a method to attach the motor. Today, armed with experience I believe I can make it work. :)


I've often considered using a brass chassis. Most of the kits I've seen have brass frames with quite thin spacers between them, but I like quite like having a lump of metal between the frames to add a bit of weight, especially for smaller locos. Perhaps such chassis kits exist and I've never found them?
Gerald H - BNR Correspondent :)

My layout: http://www.newrailwaymodellers.co.uk/Fo ... hp?t=28854

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Mountain
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Re: The BNR (another way)

Postby Mountain » Sun Nov 18, 2018 8:03 pm

Could make one. :)


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