Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Discuss Hornby Model Railway products and related topics here. This includes (Lima, Rivarossi, Jouef, Electrotren).
38degrees
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Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby 38degrees » Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:40 pm

Hi to all, I have just bought the Hornby, Imperial Airways set very pleased with it although the baggage car has different couplings to the Pullman and Green coach and it does not seem like its been altered, the problem is the baggage coach derails on the corners 2nd radius and 3rd, any one with similar problems.
The next question is did Hornby do a selection of Pullman coaches for this set, if not does anyone know what names the Pullmans had on this train on its way down to the Souh Coast. Thank you from Barry

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Bufferstop
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Bufferstop » Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:55 pm

A mixture of tensionlock variants probably explains the derailing. If they are all NEM types just change them for all the same, or rearrange them between coaches so that each coupled pair are the same type. Original Hornby (old Triang Size) coupled with slimline NEM is almost guaranteed to derail on curves. If they aren't all NEM types I'd be tempted to get out the craft knife and solvent adhesive and fit them all with the same version tensionlocks.
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Alexander Court
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Alexander Court » Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:10 pm

The old Hornby/Triang southern bogie luggage van in that train pack has old style tension lock couplers. In my experience hornby superdetailed pullmans with lights have a coupling socket which hangs too low to couple to anything anyways. I wonder if new hornby railroad mk1 bogies would swap into the bogie sockets on the bogie luggage vans? I have a rake of br mk1s which have smaller tension locks as supplied within the rake but larger ones fitted to the end coaches so they can couple to my lima full brake and my hornby railroad passenger luggage brake mk1 thing which has non-nem large tension lock couplers fitted, because hornby didn't do an upgraded bogie on the passenger luggage brake thing.

As I said about the pullman and coupling pocket height, I changed the slimmer tension locks for larger ones so it'd couple in the middle of my malachite railroad 'maunsell' coach rake, however because the pockets sit so low I have bent the bottom of the hooks at right angles so they do not catch on the sleepers/point blades/frogs, and while these hooks will hook securely onto the hoops of the maunsell coaches it is coupled between, the hooks from those coaches either side sit higher than the hoops on the pullmans couplings and subsequently do not connect at all.

Not sure if any of that waffle was in any way useful but hopefully it will be to someone.

Alex

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Bufferstop
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Bufferstop » Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:30 pm

The large Triang/Hornby couplers have a hook which is too long to drop completely into the smaller couplers, and it rides up onto the plastic at the rear of the coupler, then gets fouled up with the hook of the smaller coupler when the try to separate, or they move from side to side on curves. It even happens when you have old Hornby coupling with new Hornby. I know it costs but I change all my couplers to Bachmann narrow couplers which come in NEM, 3 hole short and three hole long sizes. An NEM socket which droops too low or sticks out way ahead of the buffers just has to go. With NEM that stick out too far I prefer to solvent weld an NEM coupler onto the shank after I've cut off the NEM pocket. Usually the height turns out ok, if it's too high or too low I glue an extra piece onto the top or bottom of the shank, attach the coupler to that and tweak it up or down by adjusting the height of the wedge fixing.
It is a bit farcical that NEM was supposed to be a plug and play solution. I think the problems stem from the difference in length between tensionlock and both the European design and KDs which are much shorter.
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Bigmet
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Bigmet » Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:28 am

Bufferstop wrote:...It is a bit farcical that NEM was supposed to be a plug and play solution...

The farcical aspect is that Hornby, nearing 20 years since they began to use the NEM coupler pocket, have still not standardised it throughout their range, or alternatively made a clear division such as: Volvo bumper size 'legacy' coupler screwed or moulded on in 'Railroad'; NEM coupler pockets in the main range.

(Generally the implementation of the NEM coupler pocket on newly tooled product is done well, although guidance on the ideal coupler type to use with it is lacking. But in this they are no different to the other RTR OO manufacturers, including Heljan which as a European HO manufacturer might have been expected to have more know how...)

38degrees
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby 38degrees » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:15 pm

Hi to Bufferstop , Bigmet and Alex, Thank you very much for your replies as to the problem, from Barry

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Bigglesof266
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Bigglesof266 » Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:07 pm

I have that train pack.

The Pullman coach and T9 loco are recent moulds with NEM couplings. The baggage car, disgustingly but typically Hornby, is the ancient mould with tension locks. Hornby's way of dumping extant stock on unsuspecting customers at the time its replacement new mould baggage car had recently released. Who'd have suspected?!!!

Another consideration, the train pack baggage car is very light, train set toy like as was. It benefits from adding a little weight, and of course wheel gauging. I can't recall if it came fitted with metal or plastic wheels. If plastic, they would have been replaced by me. Shortly thereafter, I bought the new mould to replace it, so I have the new and old for basis of comparison. Chalk and cheese, night and day. I never use the one from the train pack. I should sell it, but I've just been tardy in that regard.

Another concern I'm sorry to bear tidings of, inspect the mazak in the T9 in that pack. I can't recall which it was, but either the batch in the Imperial Airways pack or the Southern Suburban pack was bad. Unless it has already been replaced, the engine mount and support bracket disintegrates. An inspection will reveal. The good news is a superior brass replacement part is available from Peter's Spares as is a replacement Hornby support bracket, which as long as the mazak batch is OK, it's OK.

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Bigglesof266
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Re: Hornby, Imperial Airways Set

Postby Bigglesof266 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 11:34 pm

P.S. I didn't note your question re specific accessory coaches responded to elsewhere. If so, comprehension or attention oversight on my part. So to your question.

Re a supplementary "Imperial Airway Pullman Coach Pack", or coaches labeled as such, packaged and sold singly specifically intended to comprise such a historical set as Hornby did with the 1934 Brighton Belle Train Pack, no. Or more accurately perhaps, not to my knowledge.

Historical research should reveal Pullman type, specific coaches and rake.

I'd reasonably surmise that given the pax. load capacity and weight limitation -space, & old engine tech power available, along with astronomically expensive fares relative to working class earnings of those albeit physically large hulled e.g. C Class Empire Flying Boats of their mid through late 1930s glamour heyday, I should think no more than a very short rake necessary of any specific purposed allocated named train. Especially during the Great Depression,I very much doubt there'd be any Second or Third Class pax able to afford a fare, so a Pullman First Parlour, Baggage and perhaps Bar rather than Dining 1st for the short ride to the Medway at Rochester? If additional that would have been it surely? All steel K type or steel sided? I've been away playing more guitar rather than playing model railway of recent, so momentarily forgotten the minutiae. Bigmet is generally expertly informed about such things, and should bring you up to speed on which in detail.

Bottom line is that Hornby do make a load of superb Pullman types and named/numbered coaches, so putting a short historically realistic rake together should be easily doable rather inexpensively. GL. PS. Ditching that 'orrible Railroad green baggage for the contemporary mould unit is the first thing I'd be pointing my purse at though. GL. Enjoy. It's a lubbly jubbly train pack once the issues are addressed.


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