Big disappointment!

Discuss Hornby Model Railway products and related topics here. This includes (Lima, Rivarossi, Jouef, Electrotren).
Buelligan
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Big disappointment!

Postby Buelligan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:26 am

Well, Hornby have let me down. I ordered a new DCC ready Tornado for my son, for his Birthday on Tuesday. It arrived today, but unfortunately when I opened the box, 1 of the wires that goes from the tender to the loco isn't connected to anything, just flapping around loose. On top of that it looked very much like 1 of the rods is bent. In fairness to the shop, Rails of Sheffield, they offered to replace it, but that would take 7-10 days, so have instead sent me a returns label and will issue a refund.

So due to Hornby QC, Rails have now lost a sale. However, Rails loss is New Modellers gain.

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Mountain
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Mountain » Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:24 pm

Sad to hear of the issues with the locomotive you ordered. Unfortunately, I have heard of quite a few issues with quite a few modern models like this. Most models purchased will work well or no one would attempt to buy them except for collectors who never get to run them.
I tend to prefer the older models myself, which though they are not so finely detailed and are not quite so good at their slow running abilities (They are not that bad when serviced), at least they are solidly made and reliable, as they were tested in thw factory and often at the retailer as well (In front of the customer before sale) before the customers had them.
Today, due to the complex packaging to prevent damage to the fine detail on their journey half way across the world and due to the collectors market of which many will not buy if the box has been opened, some retailers refuse to test them and also, by the results of the various issues seen in the last few years, we see the occasional issue.
It is not all bad news. Certain locos have improved so much of late that they seem like very high quality models. The older designs of 0-4-0 (E.g. Smokey Joe and GWR 101 types) are in a different league compared to what they once were.
Last edited by Mountain on Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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End2end
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby End2end » Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:41 pm

Hornby :roll: ...Always leave a bit of daylight between them and the end of your bargepole. :lol:
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Mountain
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Mountain » Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:03 pm

I would not say to avoid them as many of their products are underated. It tends to be the finescale steam locos and potentially, the close coupled coachds which give the issues, though to be fair the issues I had with close coupled coaches were actually Bachmann coaches. I only put this as Hornby use a similar design.
Many of the older products brought back into production have improved by the bucketloads. Those 4 wheel coaches have metal wheels. Thw high speed 0-4-0 issues were not only corrected, but vastly improved. The class 110 DMU now stays on the track where the older Margate examples tended to ignore pointwork and carry on as if track didn't exist. (Also I believe my 110 (Chinese example) may have a five pole armiature. If it hasn't it has certainly improved with the 3 pole. I don't remember but I noticed it ran nicely).
The LNER coaches now in the Railroad range now have lovely metal wheels, as do many other older designs including much better detailing on their chassis.
I could go on. Yes, I agree if one says that certain models have been known to have issues, and these tend to be from a few of the larger super detailed steam locomotive range. I would not say to avoid them, but I wouldn't myself buy unless a dealer can test the loco in front of you on a test track which includes points. (Not a rolling road as this will not show up certain issues). That way you will know it is a good one.

Bigmet
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Bigmet » Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:49 pm

I must be purchasing from a different Hornby. This Hornby has mounted a sustained twelve year assault on my wallet, during which time they have sold me multiples of:
BR Standard Britannia pacifics (chmney rim detached on one.)
Thompson B1(back plate of bunker was weakly attached on one.)
Thompson O1
Thompson L1
Gresley B17
Peppercorn K1 (a tender side frame fell off one.)
Gresley J50

and single examples of:

Collett Castle
Ex-GER J15
Ex-GER D16/3
Ex-GER B12/3 (one of the best RTR OO steam models currently available in my opinion, right up there with the Bachmann Ivatt Atlantic and Rapido/NRM Stirling single.)

All of these ran beautifully out of the box, and continue to perform well in regular use. (There's a heap of uniformly excellent rolling stock too.)

The only problem I have with Hornby is 'where is my full fat streamlined P2, pretty please?, oh, and a J6 and V2 would be rather nice'.

Buelligan
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Buelligan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:28 pm

Well my day and disappointment got worse!

Happily sat with the kids, using my as new silver jubilee set, only had at most an hours use. Going round lovely, then a horrible noise, stopped it quickly and had a look. 1 of the rods has slightly bent, and looks like some other parts have come apart and/or bent. Just prior to this there was a bit of a rythmical squeak.

Now in a could mood, it’s back in its box, probably a write off for me and will now just be an expensive ornament, I’ve no idea how to fix or replace it all.

mjb1961
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby mjb1961 » Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:45 pm

Hi Bulligan,,,,,,sounds like one of the screws have undone it self ,,have you checked to see if one is missing ,when you've calmed down take a look at the damage ,I'm sure you could straighten the rods to a satisfactory level and get the loco up and running ,,,I've had this happen on a few Locos ,I know it shouldn't happen but it does ,one of the reasons is running too fast in reverse,,they don't like it,also check the screws are tight enough on the whole set of Locos you have ,,failing that ,you could send it into Hornby for a repair ,,give them a call ,,,,mjb

Buelligan
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Buelligan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 10:18 pm

mjb1961 wrote:Hi Bulligan,,,,,,sounds like one of the screws have undone it self ,,have you checked to see if one is missing ,when you've calmed down take a look at the damage ,I'm sure you could straighten the rods to a satisfactory level and get the loco up and running ,,,I've had this happen on a few Locos ,I know it shouldn't happen but it does ,one of the reasons is running too fast in reverse,,they don't like it,also check the screws are tight enough on the whole set of Locos you have ,,failing that ,you could send it into Hornby for a repair ,,give them a call ,,,,mjb



Well I've had despatch confirmation from New Modellers, and I've got the returns slip for Rails, so at least my son should still be getting his Tornado for his Birthday.

I've calmed down a bit about Quicksilver, I can see what's happened, but I don't know what any of the bits are called to describe them. So as a childs description, on 1 side there's a slidey bit that goes in and out of the cylinder, that's come off the rails it slides in, and the long rod attached to that is now slightly bent. Also looks like there's a bracket that a few bits fix to on the underside of the body, and that has bent down a bit, certainly looks different to the intact side anyway. I may well start a separate thread about quicksilver.

Ex-Pat
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Ex-Pat » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:49 pm

Buelligan wrote:I've calmed down a bit about Quicksilver, I can see what's happened, but I don't know what any of the bits are called to describe them. So as a childs description, on 1 side there's a slidey bit that goes in and out of the cylinder, that's come off the rails it slides in, and the long rod attached to that is now slightly bent. Also looks like there's a bracket that a few bits fix to on the underside of the body, and that has bent down a bit, certainly looks different to the intact side anyway. I may well start a separate thread about quicksilver.


The "slidey bit that goes in and out of the cylinder" is the crosshead/piston that is attached to the connecting rod.

Surely you have some form of warranty for replacement?

Buelligan
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Buelligan » Fri Feb 15, 2019 11:55 pm

Ex-Pat wrote:
Buelligan wrote:I've calmed down a bit about Quicksilver, I can see what's happened, but I don't know what any of the bits are called to describe them. So as a childs description, on 1 side there's a slidey bit that goes in and out of the cylinder, that's come off the rails it slides in, and the long rod attached to that is now slightly bent. Also looks like there's a bracket that a few bits fix to on the underside of the body, and that has bent down a bit, certainly looks different to the intact side anyway. I may well start a separate thread about quicksilver.


The "slidey bit that goes in and out of the cylinder" is the crosshead/piston that is attached to the connecting rod.

Surely you have some form of warranty for replacement?



Unfortunately not, it was new old stock, original date of 2009 I think.

mjb1961
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby mjb1961 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:57 am

Hi,,the slidey bit ,,you should be able to clip it back on ,,,I've had this happen as well ,use the other side of the loco for ref to see how it should look,,also bend any rods that are bent and the long bits that look like they should go under the body is probably the reverse lever,it does clip into the underside of the body ,,hope this helps ,,mjb

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RAF96
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby RAF96 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 9:39 am

The clue is in ‘...my new...’
Send it back under warranty, although the damage could have been self inflicted..

Many people do not realise these modern models have incredibly fine and fragile detail and cannot be handled like the old Hornby-Dublo locos. It is so easy to damage the motion by picking it up wrong and then the troubles start.

I always do an acceptance check on my models upon delivery to lubricate them per the maintenance sheet, to go over the motion and deatails checking each and every part before use. I then run it on a rolling road to be sure all is well before,it goes anywhere near the service track.

I also note from the OP that it protested by squeaking before it failed - the poor thing was trying to tell you it was unwell.
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Buelligan
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Buelligan » Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:45 pm

mjb1961 wrote:Hi,,the slidey bit ,,you should be able to clip it back on ,,,I've had this happen as well ,use the other side of the loco for ref to see how it should look,,also bend any rods that are bent and the long bits that look like they should go under the body is probably the reverse lever,it does clip into the underside of the body ,,hope this helps ,,mjb



Thanks, I've tried to take some photos of the damaged parts, but it's hard to photograph, doesn't really show up in the photos. I think I'll have to take the body off to be able to get to it properly. I can't get it to clip back on as the other but seems to be a slightly bent too.

RAF96 wrote:The clue is in ‘...my new...’
Send it back under warranty, although the damage could have been self inflicted..

Many people do not realise these modern models have incredibly fine and fragile detail and cannot be handled like the old Hornby-Dublo locos. It is so easy to damage the motion by picking it up wrong and then the troubles start.

I always do an acceptance check on my models upon delivery to lubricate them per the maintenance sheet, to go over the motion and deatails checking each and every part before use. I then run it on a rolling road to be sure all is well before,it goes anywhere near the service track.

I also note from the OP that it protested by squeaking before it failed - the poor thing was trying to tell you it was unwell.


It was 'as new', not actually brand new. it's from 2009, i doubt there will be any warranty on it. I may contact Hornby and see if they can fix it, or see if there's another company that could.

I've tried explaining to my eldest son that he'd be better off leaving his engine on the track to avoid breaking it, but he's insistent that everything needs to go back in it's box when he's finished, all engines, all the coaches etc

Unfortunately I didn't previously have a rolling road, but as of today I do, I've just used it to test run the replacement Hornby Tornado. Seems a bit tricky to get the wheels set the right distance apart for completely smooth running.

The squeak was literally 3-4 seconds before the failure, by the time i'd got my handle to the control it had failed.

10/10 for service from new modellers shop, ordered Friday morning, and delivered by 10:30 Saturday morning!

After opening this Tornado, I think the other from Rails looks very much like they've already sent it out to someone and it's been returned. The one from Rails has 4 wires coming out the loco, and going to a small white plug in the tender, and on the bottom it's stamped DCC fitted, but is in a DCC ready box, and was ordered as the DCC ready model. This replacement from NMS, doesn't say anything about DCC on the underside, and there are no wires coming out of the loco, and no plug in the tender.

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Hymirl
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby Hymirl » Sun Feb 17, 2019 2:18 am

I strongly agree with minimising handling of locos, less picking up the better. If you don't have to pack away the railway leave them sat safely on their wheels.

After all. Why have an engine shed if the engine doesn't live in it! :lol:

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RAF96
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Re: Big disappointment!

Postby RAF96 » Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:23 pm

Interesting to read on the forums that more and more people are apparently getting what seem to be ‘returned and fixed’ items in lieu of what they thought were brand new items.

Despite their no quibble returns warranty the likes of Hattons and Rails are coming up more often than expected in this respect.

To be fair I have only ever had excellent service in the past.
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